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02.02.02 | Main | Shut that bloody bazouki player up!

February 04, 2002

He used...sarcasm, sir

Hey party peopole!

I'm doing this thing that I think is really, really funny, and cool: I'm sponsoring the "Weblog of the Millennium" in the anti-bloggies!

See, in their rules, the antibloggies clearly state that I'm not even eligible, and since they're anti-, and since WWDN recieved so many bloggies...I just thought it was very funny, and stuff for me to sponsor that category. So you should head on over and nominate some cool sites, that aren't WWDN.

How about that Super Bowl? I missed most of it because I was working, but I'm so glad that New England won...way to go Underdogs!
I did get to see this one commercial, that said that if you use drugs, you're supporting terrorism, which is nice, because I thought that giving 43 million dollars to the Taliban to kill opium poppies was supporting terrorism, but TV learned me good.

Speaking of Emperor Bush, how about that new budget? Yay! Defecit spending is back! We're gonna party like it's 1989! Pick up your Rubik's Cube, and put some shoulder pads in your T-shirt!

I mean, I didn't think Bush could do much better than declaring war on the entire world in his State of the Union address, or trying to sneak in another broadside against women's rights to control their own bodies...but he totally went and did it! That crazy G.W...you never know what he'll do next!

Darnit. I totally have to leave for work now, just as I was getting my sarcasm mojo workin'

I hope everyone has a great day.

Try this: hold a door open for a stranger today. It's a nice thing to do :)

Posted by wil at February 4, 2002 08:14 AM
Comments

Dianetics, Junior, much better than Krishnah.
Dianetics, Junior, much better indeed.

Posted by: Fraize at February 4, 2002 08:17 AM

I hate to have to say it, but sometimes, ya know, I really really enjoy being a Canadian!

Posted by: Duchess at February 4, 2002 08:23 AM

I am so glad the Patriots won, at long last.
Gawd, don'tcha just love Georgie-boy? I listened with half an ear to the State of the Union address but had to leave the room because it was pissing me off. I heard about this scary new legislation that is seeking to classify a fetus as a legal 'person' supposedly so that low income pregnant women can get coverage under existing state programs. Thing is, they already can, it's a ruse. Anyway, Bush is one sneaky bastard. Grrr, politics on Monday morning. Back to work.

Posted by: fenaray at February 4, 2002 08:31 AM

Hmm...just watch some Twin Peaks

Posted by: Eamon Hardiman at February 4, 2002 08:35 AM

Wow, I have always wondered if the smart kid from "Trek" had as much of a brain in real life. I see that he does. I am pleased. I may not agree, but that is what makes this country great. Nuttin' but love for ya Wil!!!!

Posted by: Michelle at February 4, 2002 08:35 AM

Ever since he was elected (and even before), I never found anyone saying that GWB was the right guy for this job.
Who elected him, really ?

Posted by: Xavier at February 4, 2002 08:39 AM

Tyranny grows best in the soil of fear. A lesson GW learned well (along with most other politicians.) Keep the sarcasm going WW.

Posted by: 'Frey at February 4, 2002 08:39 AM

I thought he was perfect.

Then I learned he was a Democrat.

I suppose I can stomach the Bush-bashing to continue gleaning bits of wisdom from the all-powerful sarcastic Hollywood creature that is Wil Wheaton.

Posted by: Stari at February 4, 2002 08:39 AM

Yay, finally, and it only took 42 years for the Patriots to do it...go figure...now...next on t he agenda, Red Sox winning a World Series *snort* or not...

Hmm...already held a door for someone, now what am I gonna do with the rest of my day...

Posted by: Danie at February 4, 2002 08:46 AM

another broadside against women's rights to control their own bodies...

Will, don't be a dick. Think of the BABY you American Loon.

Posted by: monkey at February 4, 2002 08:49 AM

Stari said: "I suppose I can stomach the Bush-bashing to continue gleaning bits of wisdom from the all-powerful sarcastic Hollywood creature that is Wil Wheaton."

Oh, I think Dubya can take it.

Wil just is helping to represent the 14-or-so-percent that DON'T approve.

Yay, underdog.

And Xavier, in answer to your question about "who elected" him, the answer, definitively, is no one, since this term, the office was not decided by election. I'm trying not to be smart-assy about it, but there you go.

You wants to fight, you gots ta fight fair.

You muthafucka, ho.

You muthafucka, ho.

You KNOW what time it is.

Posted by: Rob Matsushita at February 4, 2002 08:50 AM

Funny thing that, we saw that same commercial (drugs=terrorism) and wondered the same exact thing.

(Have you seen the new public service announcement that's recently been airing in support of choice: "What could be more American than choice?" I think I sat unblinking, wondering if I could really be hearing what I was hearing. It was rather a happy moment.)

I wouldn't call him a Democrat -- a Libertarian, mebbe. :)

Posted by: sandra at February 4, 2002 08:53 AM

i love you Wil Wheaton, and i'm not gay.

Posted by: Toby at February 4, 2002 08:53 AM

TV, what's that? It has been banned from my home, hubby and I just lost interest in it. We go to the, get this now, library. We have an antenna so we can get a total of 2 channels that we never bother to watch.

I didn't vote for Bush, voted for Nader. I'm an old republican I guess when I think that women control their bodies by chosing what to do with them, but once they become pregnant, it isn't just their body any longer. The woman made her choice. Abortion is not birth control. I am a little biased though because my husband and I can't have children, and I can't stand to think of babies being murdered when there are empty homes like mine.

Posted by: manda at February 4, 2002 08:55 AM

*sighs*

Mixed emotions on this... I live in Texas. ( Waco on top of that ) I like Goerge for the most part, but I hate this war. I hate trying to explain to my kids whats going on. I hate the fact that I even have to.

By the way... what else do you do after you held the door open, say thanks to all that hold it for you :)

Amy

Posted by: Amy at February 4, 2002 08:58 AM

y'know, i can't help but wonder... when are they going to make a sequel to 'showgirls?'

in these new and uncertain times, i think we could all do with another dose of the verhoeven love.

and wil, i ::know:: you want that part.

get those tassels on, boy. there's a tube of adhesive and a fresh set of pasties in the cupboard.

oh yeah.

Posted by: hot soup girl at February 4, 2002 08:59 AM

and you too, dubya. i want you greased up and in sequins by oh-six-hundred.

Posted by: hot soup girl at February 4, 2002 09:03 AM

"I'm hard. Why aren't you?"

If we ever meet in real life, Hot Soup Girl (love that name), you have to ask me to do me Elizabeth Berkley impression for you.

Posted by: Rob Matsushita at February 4, 2002 09:03 AM

Manda, I'm totally with you when you say abortion shouldn't be used as birth control. Unfortunately, often times the same people who want to restrict abortion also want to restrict sex education and birth control.

Knowledge is power, man.

Posted by: sandra at February 4, 2002 09:06 AM

By the way, for those of you wanting to spark up the abortion debate, check out the soapbox area--there's a really good discussion going on over there.

Posted by: Rob Matsushita at February 4, 2002 09:08 AM

Ah the underdog... the mighty mighty underdog.
Never underestimate the power of their force.
Woot!

I ignored the state of the blah blah because I knew what those blah blahs would contain and I'm angry enough at the world to be the next Harlan Ellison.. I did my part for world peace ya know.

My powerful flu meds and Wil rock the house.

-K
"Look at this. An entire generation of Cinderellas and there's no slipper coming."- Elaine "Almost Famous"

Posted by: MissKittyFantastico at February 4, 2002 09:10 AM

as a former fetus: "thank you mom"

Posted by: tyrone slothorp at February 4, 2002 09:12 AM

Time to pull out the old parachute pants and dust off the MC Hammer album. I like how "W" is trying to use his personal popularity and transfer that to his agenda. "Wow, he's doing such a good job defending America's honor ... maybe I was wrong about a woman having a choice."

Posted by: tj at February 4, 2002 09:14 AM

rob said 'you have to ask me to do me Elizabeth Berkley impression for you.'

that's almost worth flying 13,000 kilometres for.

as long as it involves thrashing about in a swimming pool exercising extraordinary abdominal strength.

oh, and not evolving as a character, no matter what events occur in the turgid plot that is your life.

that's important.

keep an eye on that suitcase.

Posted by: hot soup girl at February 4, 2002 09:16 AM

Manda, I'm wondering, if you beleive that after a woman becomes pregnant, it's not just her body anymore, how do you feel about abortion when the woman's life is in danger by carrying the pregnancy to full term? Do the fetus' rights eclipse the woman's rights? I think that's where legislation that declares a fetus a person with legal rights could lead, expecially under the current administration. Just something to think about.
~Lorraine

Posted by: SLS at February 4, 2002 09:17 AM

Dear Wil,
Why does your name only have one 'l'? Thanks!

Posted by: ernie at February 4, 2002 09:17 AM

I was super thrilled with the Pats, particularly having two Michigan alumni like Tom Brady and Ty Law making major contributions!

To anyone who cares-name the last former Michigan Wolverine that was Super Bowl MVP.

Looks like Wil's looking to pick a fight today :)

Posted by: Jon at February 4, 2002 09:19 AM

I held the door open for a stranger this morning without even reading WWDN. How's THAT for great minds thinking alike? (and yes, then when somebody held the door for me i said Thank You :-)

Tyrone: i'm glad it all worked out for you and your mom, but for some people, it's just not the best/right thing to do, for the woman, or the fetus.

Posted by: Suberb Human Bean at February 4, 2002 09:20 AM

Hot Soup Girl said: "as long as it involves thrashing about in a swimming pool exercising extraordinary abdominal strength."

I'l have you know that my days of faking unrealistically loud, epileptic orgasms in public places is over, thank you very much.

These days, it's the real deal.

Which is why they probably won't let me in Whole Foods anymore.

Posted by: Rob Matsushita at February 4, 2002 09:22 AM

Those commercials about drugs were good. The Budweiser commercials were better. And the Dale Jr. commercial was the best. And BUSH IS THE MAN!! Second to Jr. of course. LOL! I'm glad that in my first election voting the guy I voted for won.

Posted by: DaleJrBlueEyes at February 4, 2002 09:36 AM

Right wil,

We should have voted for Ralph Nadar like you did.

Iran, Iraq, & North Korea is the whole rest of the World? I guess if you make a map of the most likely places that a Nuclear Bomb will be made that will end up blowing up one or more of our major cities, I guess you are right.

Posted by: bluesman at February 4, 2002 09:38 AM

Oh second comment on the election cause everyone likes to say gore was gipped of a win. Thats bull. My vote was never counted. California doesn't count the absentee votes. So my vote never was counted. So you think florida was the only place where people didn't get to have their vote counted you are wrong!! I hate that I have to vote absentee but I go to school out of state.

Posted by: DaleJrBlueEyes at February 4, 2002 09:40 AM

This place is addictive, ecspecially when you have writers block !


First off... I am not sure on what to say on the womans choice issue. I know what I chose and, what was right for me, but still it was my choice, and it may not be right for anyone else.

Second... the whole idea of America becoming the aggressive party in this war... just scary in my opinion. Theres a differnce between going after specific groups that are targeting us and going after entire countries... I mean why fight if there is no need to !
Oh well just my opinion, oh well back to the book... heaven help my publishers :)

Amy

Posted by: Amy at February 4, 2002 09:44 AM

Thanks Wil, you too.

Posted by: ymous_annon at February 4, 2002 09:45 AM

DaleJr,

I'm beginning to like you.

Posted by: BurntHombre at February 4, 2002 09:45 AM

personally, i practice safe sex. i try to avoid any sexual activity that may result in damaged vertibrae and/or permanent paraplegia.

and stardust casino can go to hell.

Posted by: hot soup girl at February 4, 2002 09:50 AM

ernie typed out:"Dear Wil,
Why does your name only have one 'l'? Thanks!"


According to Ann on the Weakest Link its because hes pretentious.

As far as the abortion, pro-life or what ever u want to call it debate, Please folks, dont start.

Its not an issue where you are gonna change anybodys mind, Its way past talking about politics or religion when you go there.

Posted by: bluesman at February 4, 2002 09:54 AM

dearest wil, if you ran for president i would vote for you twice.
and look! you started an abortion debate! i have much to say on the topic, but suffice it to say that i am a co-director of my campus' chapter of students for choice. so yeah, you could say i'm a little passionate.
i think i'm going to have to move somewhere else. seriously. i can't deal with the kind of shit he's pulling.

Posted by: lauren! at February 4, 2002 09:57 AM

Wow. There's not much more I can say. A friend pointed me to this. I'm sure you've heard it all from the Trekkies (Trekkers?), but, wow? It sounds cruel in some fashion, but I had no idea you were a smart cookie. People tend to judge actors by their character, which isn't very fair, and I'm glad you never took any of that to heart. (Though, I think you should count your lucky stars you weren't Neelix)

If not for ST:TNG, I would not have met my husband (online love affair gone wonderfully right). I've always wanted to thank /someone/ for that. :)

Warm regards from a Trek fan,
~:) Babs

Posted by: Babyslime at February 4, 2002 09:57 AM

Case study: if as neighbours we could never stand each other, and that you suspect I'm buying ammo to come and kill you, does it make it right to come and burn my house ? Would Justice be on your side ?
(oh, I forgot the pre-requisite: for this case study, you do not have the majority at the Court.)

Posted by: michel v at February 4, 2002 09:57 AM

Don't people in the States usually hold open the
door for strangers? If not, Odd.

Posted by: ymous_annon at February 4, 2002 10:01 AM

Sandra - I totally agree with you. If there was
a better sex education program, more freely
available birth control, and better support for
parents of unwanted pregnancies, I'd be much more
comfortable with the idea of outlawing abortion.
As it is now, outlawing abortion is most likely
just going to kill people who can't afford to pay
for safe illicit abortions.

SLS - It doesn't have to be one thing for all
situations. Outlawing freely available abortions
to anyone who wants them doesn't mean you have
to disallow all abortions under all possible
circumstances. A case where a woman's life is in
danger is completely different from a case where
a woman's life is going to be inconvenienced for
9 months.

Also, consider that in cases where the woman's
life is in danger, the baby is usually in danger
as well. In that case, I'd choose the life of the
known alive person (the mother) over the baby.

Posted by: jessica at February 4, 2002 10:06 AM

Bluesman said: "As far as the abortion, pro-life or what ever u want to call it debate, Please folks, dont start. Its not an issue where you are gonna change anybodys mind, Its way past talking about politics or religion when you go there."

Don't always think in competative terms; a healthy debate also outlines and clarifies everyone's point of view--and can help to solidify an opinion once every perspective is understood.

Posted by: Rob Matsushita at February 4, 2002 10:11 AM

Jessica,

You are right on! I'd been trying to think of a way to write something here like that that didn't make me look completely naive or like I was sitting on the fence. Very well put!

Shifting subjects, the other thing that I thought was on this $43 million grant to the Taliban. I'd never heard about this and was certainly stunned. However, I wanted to try to find a more objective article on it rather than take any news source from an opinion column that would put some sort of spin on it. For any one interested, here's a link to it (Mr. Scheer actually has it on his site)http://www.robertscheer.com/1_natcolumn/01_columns/taliban.htm

Posted by: Jon at February 4, 2002 10:20 AM

First point: Hmm.. There have been interesting points made so far. I believe that abortion should be legal, but only in very rare circumstances. Examples: the child is a direct result of rape or incest, or the mother's/child's life is in serious jeopardy by continuing the pregnancy. Other than that, I say, "Hey, you made the choice to have sex. There are known consequences to that. When you choose to have protected or unprotected intercourse, you are making a choice to accept those long-term risks for short-term pleasure." It's my position that intimate relations should be reserved for marriage. Don't get me wrong, I'm all about choice. People make a choice when they choose to have sex with someone, and they should be aware of, and be responsible for, all the risks.

Second point: I don't appreciate it (and I'm NOT accusing anyone here of doing this, I'm just saying) when people think that someone else is closed-minded because they disagree. Many people might say I'm closed-minded for having this opinion. It's just not true.

Uh, in closing, I would just like to say, "Use Linux, think deep, and ... go to Lake Powell this summer (it rocks)!"

Posted by: nitrogen at February 4, 2002 10:36 AM

What I find so horrifying is that there are so many people who say "oh, but there's always adoption... there are so many families who want a child so bad and can't get one." Have you ever heard of adoption parties? Children who have gone from childhood to adulthood looking for someone to adopt them without ever finding one? There are thousands on top of thousands of children out there looking for parents and no one wants them. I'm disgusted by people who can apparently only love babies and not the children waiting to be adopted. When there are no more people waiting to be adopted with no luck THEN I'd be willing to consider the adoption argument. Until then, though, try again.

Posted by: KellyV at February 4, 2002 10:40 AM

Don't Blame me I voted with the MAJORITY

and Dont blame me MY VOTE DIDDN"T COUNT

Were so farked.. can I defect to Canada now?

Posted by: Jacob Metcalf at February 4, 2002 10:41 AM

I love you Wil Wheaton and I AM gay.

Posted by: Jacob Metcalf at February 4, 2002 10:43 AM

Is this a bad time to say I am from Texas?
(and I don't even know where Crawford Texas is!)

Loved the commericals..loved the E*TRADE Monkey commerical..."We got a friend in Florida for you!"...LMAO!!!!

Party like 1989!!! WHOOOHOOOO!!! I was only...10 or 11..."Go Wil! Go Wil!!" *dances*

Anyway...till laterz, Ya'LL!! :P

Posted by: Shayne in Houston, TX at February 4, 2002 10:47 AM

Argh, I just HAVE to respond to this: ...I believe that abortion should be legal, but only in very rare circumstances. Examples: the child is a direct result of rape or incest...

People who say this must have conflicting ideas in their heads about abortion. Most anti-abortionists believe that a child is a child upon conception and therefore abortion is murder. To say that it's okay to abort a child if it's rape leads to the conclusion that the child is less a human being because it was a forced act. Since when do we "civilized" humans visit the sins of the parents upon the child? Furthermore, to say it's okay to abort a child when the mother was forced into sex but NOT okay to abort a child when the mother did so willingly says that you think of baring an unwanted child as a punishment. Understanding that a baby is a baby is a baby would mean that the child of rape is still a human life. Just because it was born of a terrible act does not make it less so. And the baring of that child is not a punishment on the raped mother. Nor should it be thought of as a punishment for women who choose to have sex and get pregnant.

Therefore, if you really think that abortion should be legal when the child is a direct result of rape or incest then I think you really need to think about WHAT leads you to believe this because I do not see a rational argument behind it.

Posted by: KellyV at February 4, 2002 10:53 AM

I agree with Mandi on this one. Especially when the woman has made the choice to have sex. That was her choice. Now the government is suppose to say that was a bad choice, so here's an option for you, have an abortion. I think this is just one example out hundreds of the goverment wasting tax payer money. Just my opinion.

Posted by: PudSpucker at February 4, 2002 10:59 AM

I just wanted to let you know that I'm thankful that someone else is paying attention to the stupidity that seems to be running rampant during Emperor Bush's reign! Just making sure I wasn't going crazy.

Now I'm just going to sit back and wait for him to declare WWIII, officially crown himself emperor and wipe all intelligence off this planet.

Thanks... I'm done ranting for now.

Posted by: Jennifer Havey at February 4, 2002 11:14 AM

It would be nice if every woman who wound up pregnant and alone fully understood the risks in advance of that "moment of passion." Unfortunately, many don't. They get their sex education from buddies the same age and maybe a television show or two. Many parents just say, "Don't do it" and that's all the info they get. School? Not too many are allowed to educate on sexuality, and those that do find that kids are opted out by their parents who want to teach it themselves. Of course, what they teach is, "Don't do it" and nothing else. The results are obvious.

If you think outlawing abortion saves babies, you are pitifully wrong. You have only to look at the "prom mom" case in New Jersey, and the many, many instances of newborn murder and abandonment throughout the country to see the sad result of young girls who don't have abortions out of fear of parental notification laws alone. These girls don't think adoption, they don't think through much at all, and full-term, birthed babies, who no one can argue are alive or not, are killed. We will be inundated with these murders, or the deaths of girls giving birth in bathroom stalls like the poor young college student in recent news. Does this help anyone? Does this save the mothers or the children? No.

Increase sex education in schools, camps, libraries, clubs...everywhere that kids can be reached. Increase television and radio play of condom ads and birth control messages. Above all, keep abortion legal, private, and unrestricted. If you don't want an abortion, don't have one, but don't dictate to the rest of the world. We ain't have'n it.

Posted by: Angry Girl at February 4, 2002 11:16 AM

I have to side with the pro-choice gang on all this - of course, where I live, a woman has the right to choose about what goes on in her body. Has had that right since 1969. Abortion is used for various reasons, none of which anyone who is not female would really understand. If a fetus is gonna be called a legal person, than is a live person a "pre-deceased human"? To quote some woman I wish I could remember the name of: "get your laws off my body". No one has a right to choose but the individual who it involves. Last time I checked, men could not bear children.

And cheers, Wil, for being a Democrat when all seem to be against the very notion. And don't get me wrong, I think children are great, but the I refer to the ones that are wanted. (this place does claim to be open to debate, so any bashers please try to keep the language clean.

Posted by: Duchess at February 4, 2002 11:25 AM

For starters, I'm amazed that everyone has to go off on the abortion issue instead of the whole voting for some blog about cheese, cats or me.

That's a bummer, but I'll throw my damn hat in, anyway.

Before we focus on the issue of sex education and abortion, perhaps we should focus on the issue of parenting.

I don't know about most of you, but I know that my father used a firm hand...he wasn't abusive, but when I was out of line, I knew it, and my rear-end knew it.

Dear lord, this could go on forever, so I'll stop. The point is, while the abortion issue is a hot topic, and even hotter topic should be the education of people for how they should BE parents...not a handbook or a Dr. Spock, but more along the lines of what it truly means to have a child and what the sacrifices are.

And then, maybe people will understand how important an issue like abortion could be.

But until everyone starts getting a little more granular in the scenarios, it really doesn't add up to me.

Those of you with (step) children, I commend you, maybe.

Posted by: Roughy at February 4, 2002 11:26 AM

Got a wacky idea - why not extend the health care coverage to the pregnant mothers intead of saying it's for unborn children and leaching it off children's health care -- you know, the women who actually go to the doctors and receive the care? I know when I went for prenatal care it was 90% all about me.

C'mon people, as it's so important for women to receive excellent prenatal care then lobby your states on behalf of WOMEN. If it really does mean that much to all of us, then create a provision in state's medicare programs for women's prenatal care that raises the annual household income to what it is for CHIP. How bad would that be?

I understand it's to take advantage of the current programs, but I do believe that this is a bullshit political manouver.

Updated Texas Rankings Under Bush:
1st in Children without Health Insurance %...1st in Toxic Air Releases...1st in Smog Days (Houston)...1st in poorest counties(3)...3rd in Hunger %...5th in Highest Teen Birth Rate...41st in Breast Cancer Screenings...45th in Mothers Receiving Pre-Natal Care...46th in Public Libraries and Branches...46th in High School Completion Rate...46th in Water Resources Protection...47th in Delivery of Social Services...48th in Literacy...48th in Per Capita Funding for Public Health...48 in Best Place to Raise Children (29th before Bush)*...48th in Spending for Parks and Recreation...48th in Spending for the Arts...49th in Spending for the Environment...50th in Women with Health Insurance...50th in Teachers' Salaries plus Benefits... *Children's Rights Council. Only one accredited child-care center exists for every 2,637 children. A fourth of children still are not immunized by age 2. --Texas Freedom Network.

Posted by: EmmaPeel007 at February 4, 2002 11:26 AM

Hmm, I was really wanting to stay out of the abortion debate, but this point struck me:

"Hey, you made the choice to have sex. There are known consequences to that. When you choose to have protected or unprotected intercourse, you are making a choice to accept those long-term risks for short-term pleasure."

So sorry to hear you've contracted HIV from your cheating boyfriend/husband, but it was your choice to have sex, and now you'll have to live with the consequences. I'm sorry but we will not do anything to treat the illness or try to save your life. This is the long-term risk for that short-term pleasure. I sure hope it was worth it.

And I'm also using sarcasm people, in case you missed it. ;-)

Posted by: Mandy at February 4, 2002 11:33 AM

Wow...

Just think what we could be commenting on if Wil didn't have to go to work and turned the sarcasm on full force....

Posted by: Jon at February 4, 2002 11:33 AM

Shoulder Pads? Rubix Cube?

That's 1985.

If we want to go back to 1989, we' d have to grab our Trapper Keepers and don our Batman T-Shirts with acid washed denim.

Posted by: Kimberly3 at February 4, 2002 11:35 AM

Wil,
My husband and I loved your Character on ST:NG. I feel that the writers didn't care about your character or didn't know what to do with your character. They had no respect for him. He had so much potential if they tried. I hated what they did to Wes by having him have a personality change and drop out of star fleet...Go figure. You are a wonderful actor and from what I read from this site of yours...Your a cool, intelligant, and fun guy. Alright enough flattery from me. Anyways I am from Virginia but now live in Canada....And I am going thru landed immagrant status But if George W. gets re-elected in the next election I am going to apply for citizenship here. GO CANADA! Just thought I'd share that info

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 11:38 AM

Wait a second, Trapper Keepers were the thing when I was in early elementary which puts it sometime around '85 or earlier, too. I had my Batman shirt when I was in about 4th grade which makes THAT about '86....

Posted by: KellyV at February 4, 2002 11:50 AM

"Bushes are nice 'cause they don't have prickers."

"Unless they do."

"This one did."

"Ouch!"

Posted by: ingojax5 at February 4, 2002 11:55 AM

I would like to see abortion outlawed in every state except Texas and Florida.

And then only available to those with incomes in excess of $750,000/year.

And then made mandatory.

For all families whose last names start with B.

End in H.

And have a U.

(You see where I'm going here? The train is almost pulling into the station. Hold on).

And an S.

In the middle.

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 11:59 AM

I've been watching the 'War on Terrorism' now for quite a while, and not because it's been a spectator sport.
I am a soldier.
Yes, you heard me, I am a soldier serving in the Canadian Armed Forces in a Land based Reserve Infantry Unit as a Medical Assistant.
I'm watching the war on terrorism because I want to know when I'll be recieving that phone call tell me to drop everything, pack up my kit and go.
It's a scary thought, I'll share that with everyone. I don't particularlt enjoy the thought of going to war.
But I know someone has got to do it, and when I signed on the dotted line, I committed myself to making sure that people like Wil, and people like all of you, are safe.
I may die, I may come back with limbs missing, I may come back and not be the same person I was before I left, and that is the price I am willing to pay to make sure all of you are safe.
We don't ask for much, if anything. But we are human, we have families and loved ones, we've shared much the same experiences as the civilian populace, just our jobs are different.

Just do me one favour today, all of you, please?

Find a soldier...any soldier, and thank him for what he's done.
~Kaylin

Posted by: Kaylin at February 4, 2002 11:59 AM

Kaylin:

As a Canadian who would probably lose my mind if I had to go to war I would like to say a huge, giant "Thanks" to those of you who are able to handle it and volunteer to do so. I have a lot of issues with the military but they are with the management of it by people/groups who would probably never see the front lines and not with the individuals who go out there to protect the rest of us. *Drinks a toast to Kaylin*

Posted by: Gaea at February 4, 2002 12:19 PM

Hey I don't wanna have people get me wrong but with this whole drugs thing, maybe you should remember that next time you buy gasoline the Suadi Arabian Royal House that Osama Bin Laden came from will be making a profit. In other news though, G.W. is a moron and I'm trying to have faith That congress won't allow him anything after the next election.

Posted by: Sean at February 4, 2002 12:30 PM

Thanks Gaea. *smiles*
That really made my day.

And yeah, I kind of agree with you on that issue. Some of the guys at the top REALLY have their heads up their arses.
~Kaylin

Posted by: Kaylin at February 4, 2002 12:34 PM

You people are amusing.

Breaking down the concept of abortion into moral arguments. People should have the right to do what they want with their bodies. Looking at it from your moral religious perspectives will never allow you to see the error in those who seem to think that there should be exceptions to ANY choice. I should know. I've made that mistake in the past.

Posted by: h0rus at February 4, 2002 12:35 PM

Kaylin, I agree - without people like you the rest of us wouldn't have the leisure - or possibly the free speech, either - to sit on our butts and discuss issues like abortion, politics etc. You are appreciated - take care.

And Jenn - welcome to Canada! Hope you get your papers. Since healthcare is provided free of charge here for everyone (for the moment, anyway, as there are some rumblings about two-tier health care), all women who need pre-natal care get it, regardless of income. So if anyone else wants to move here...come on up!

Also, very interesting to see so many different opinons on this debate. (Guess this is time for the Voltaire quote, right?) But really, I do respect others rights to disagree with me - at least we get to say what's on our minds. Poor Wil, we kinda did ignore your other topics, didn't we? oops.

Posted by: Duchess at February 4, 2002 12:36 PM

Kaylin,

"I may die, I may come back with limbs missing, I may come back and not be the same person I was before I left, and that is the price I am willing to pay to make sure all of you are safe."

Much obliged!

Get off your high-horse. There's more to our freedom that that, kid. Sorry if this seems like a flame. But I'm fed up with every enlisted 'man' shoving that in the face of any person they meet.

Posted by: h0rus at February 4, 2002 12:41 PM

Kaylin,
Thanks from a hoser you're protecting in Victoria,BC. And many thanks to your American colleagues who are also putting their hind quarters on the line. Did you see the "I love NY" bumper sticker on the back of the Canadian Coyote personel carrier offloaded in Afghanistan this weekend? Great stuff.

Wil - keep up your healthy criticisms of Bush's approach to things. The US is, after all, a republic and not a monarchy. I respect the fact that the Bush administration may have found a lot of evidence of the involvement of Iran/Iraq/North Korea in terrorist activities, but I'd rather be hearing evidence than inflammatory rhetoric.

btw, thaniks for pointing out that Bush administration $43 million payment to the Taliban last year (the bastards - Bush and the Taliban). I think this sort of narrow approach to supporting regimes is what keeps giving the US, a great country, a black eye around the world. It certainly didn't begin with Bush, however. It seems like an anachronism from the Cold War, and I'd like to think the US could find better solutions. (When I'm in charge, of course, I will do much better).
-D

Posted by: synchronicity at February 4, 2002 12:56 PM

I always had a "thing" for Wesley... but politically... I think I'm in love with Wil. ;-) Too bad you had to go to work... I love a good diatribe!

Posted by: Ronda at February 4, 2002 12:59 PM

As a midwesterner who was transplanted in Texas four years ago, I have but one thing to say. I have not an ounce of sympathy or understanding for anything I have seen George Bush do in office ever. Houston has one of the worst school districts in the nation and the worst air in the nation. The response from Dubya? On the school issue, just test the students more. When you're already at the bottom of the national standards, there's not really anywhere to go but up. So now Houston school districts spend most of the year teaching how to pass the standardized tests and not actually teaching the students. I am not exagerating. I have taken night classes with elementary teachers and they were not happy with the new TASP standards. The response to the air quality issue? Lower the speed on the freeways in Houston to 55mph. That was it. As if the majority of Houston's air problems stem from car exhaust and NOT the massive amounts of crap spewing out of the billion oil refineries. Just think, with expanded coal burning and oil drilling, in just a few short years Houston's air could be the nation's air.
Sorry for the lengthy post.

Posted by: Kari at February 4, 2002 01:01 PM

Well, I decided to put in my two cents on abortion, since I did some research. I'm not a doctor or anything so I may be a little skewed but I think it may be acceptable to say that a fetus doesn't have feelings yet but he/she will and since most unwanted children are born into the poorest families there are good chances that child won't eat, and by F'ing god in my mind starvation is a hellavu lot worse than dying before you know it. And also, with Bush's economic plan, that lower class that doesn't eat is gonna get a whole lot bigger. So to all those people who want to be anti-abortion I certainly hope I see you out on the street putting your every free cent and scrap into the hands of a kid who won't be eating like you. and I apologize for the Saudi Arabia typo

Posted by: Sean at February 4, 2002 01:02 PM

So...anyone get to see the season premiere of the new look Sesame Street today?

Posted by: Jon at February 4, 2002 01:08 PM

Horus:

Easy up on Kaylin. Yes there is more to freedom than that but I don't think she (?) was trying to shove anything down our throats. She was just doing what the rest of us are doing, which is writing down her thoughts and feelings. I think her comments show she didn't just sign up for the money (ha ha) and takes her role seriously and thought about it carefully before signing up. I don't think she was trying to be "holier than thou".

Boy this certainly has been a "heavy" comment thread. I'm tempted to post some big fluff comment just to lighten things up. *grin*

Posted by: Gaea at February 4, 2002 01:08 PM

You mean I missed it? Yikes.

Posted by: Duchess at February 4, 2002 01:13 PM

Gaea,
Yes, we're due for a peculiar and acerbic comment from Spudnuts to lighten us up.
:)
-D

Posted by: synchronicity at February 4, 2002 01:14 PM

Well, I'll start off w/ the easier stuff. I am sooo thrilled that the Patriots won the Super Bowl. They have been my favorite AFC team since I was a kid and they are my second favorite NFL team overall. I love that they were underdogs. I love that it was down to the last second. I love that the kicker won the game for them. I love that Tom Brady is the youngest quaterback to win a Super Bowl.

Now to the more complicated stuff. Abortion is a tough one. There is so much to consider. Women's rights. Babies' rights. Heck, even fathers' rights. I think about women who were raped and then I think about things like what Kelly V pointed out. I think about the 2 women I know who do use abortion as a type of birth control. And I think about the classroom debate a few years back in which every anti-abortion/pro-life person quoted from the Bible to explain their reasons why abortion should be illegal. That one really upsets me. I don't believe in their God and neither do a lot of other people. Why should this gov't make laws based on the religious beliefs of just a portion of the population and expect those who aren't part of that religious belief to live by them? I am so happy that (as I'm typing this) no one has made that arguement: "Because my God said so!" After all considerations I think abortion should be legal. Its not for me, I couldn't do it. But I don't want to tell some one else she can't. I'm so afraid of stories like those Angry Girl described (un-wanted babies murdered after they are born or left abandoned). And I also don't want to judge women who have had abortions -tho I find it hard not to be a bit judgemental toward those 2 women I know who do use abortion as birth control but they both have a lot of other problems as well. I also think there needs to be improvements in sex education. I also think that Kely V made another good point when she talked about the children who aren't adopted b/c so many people are willing to adopt only newborns.

And now on to Dubya. He is using the fear and uncertainty of the people to push his agenda. I haven't disagreed w/ everything he's said & done but I have disagreed w/ most of it. There have been other politicians (other presidents, my state govenors, local mayors, etc.) I've disagreed w/ but I thought that most of them at least had the best interests of his/her constituents in mind. I'm not so sure of that w/ regard to Bush (and I would say the same of my state's former govenor Christie Todd Nitwit).

Well, that's just my 2 cents worth. Thanx for letting me rant.

Posted by: jl at February 4, 2002 01:19 PM

god i love republicans and their christian agenda.
/sarcasm

Posted by: gumpei yokoi at February 4, 2002 01:33 PM

Wil, did u blok Jess from ur site or me from going on the soapbox or comments on my screen name??

Posted by: MeL at February 4, 2002 01:33 PM

Wow! It took me a damn long time to type all that. There were like 20 more posts made between the beginning of my little rant and my finally posting it! Thats what happens when one tries to keep up w/ the goings on at WWDN and keep up w/ the job at the same time. I'm wrapping stuff up at the job and I'm looking forward to reading all the posts when I get home as well as those that may come after my rantings.

Posted by: jl at February 4, 2002 01:42 PM

>> we're due for a peculiar and acerbic comment from Spudnuts to lighten us up.

Vanna weeps silently at the sight of her hook.

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 01:53 PM

The truly sad and frightening thing is that Resident(not a typo)Bush will probably get re-elected. And I am quite certain that more than 14% are against Bush, most are just afraid to say anything "unpatriotic" in this time of "crisis".I sure don't want Ashcroft's cronies knocking on MY door.

Posted by: Sylvain at February 4, 2002 01:55 PM

To get off the abortion issue for a moment let's go back to something else. Someone said earlier, "Who elected [Bush], really?" The answer to that is the electoral college did - not the people. Gore won the popular vote by 500,000 votes. Does no one realize that we didn't actually elect our president? We elected someone else to make that decision for us, because we, apparently, can not make that decision for ourselves. The majority of the individual votes counted went to Gore, not Bush. Isn't anyone else dismayed by this fact?

Other than that, loved the entry Wil! It cracked me up.

Posted by: Nayir at February 4, 2002 01:56 PM

Well, I for one *did* vote for GWB, and I ... do not regret it. Oh, the horror.:) So I guess I am not included in the 'we' of the sentence: "...we did not elect our president"?

Hey, at least I voted.

Posted by: tammy at February 4, 2002 02:10 PM

BurntHombre thanks! LOL!

Posted by: DaleJrBlueEyes at February 4, 2002 02:17 PM

I think having babies is a purely selfish act in the first place. Potential parents seem to forget about overpopulation and dwindling resources when they decide to breed. If you can't have children, if your "home is empty", there are thousands of children waiting to be adopted, so I can't feel sorry for you.
As far as the armed forces,my opinion of it (and humans in general) is very pessimistic. I feel it is also a selfish act. I feel that most people who join the armed forces or the police are not doing it for the betterment of others' lives.
They do it to enhance their career options,to travel on the government dime, or just to carry a gun. I feel most of these people were bullied in school and have something to prove to the world, or they were bullies themselves and are taking the next logical step. There are some who do it for their country, but alas, these individuals are a precious few. Bottom line: you signed up.
I can't feel sorry for you, and since I didn't ask you to protect me, I won't thank you.
*grabs m&m's,waits for the impending flames*

Posted by: Sylvain at February 4, 2002 02:20 PM

Tammy said: "Well, I for one *did* vote for GWB, and I ... do not regret it. Oh, the horror.:) So I guess I am not included in the 'we' of the sentence: "...we did not elect our president"?"

You still are, as the votes for the election don't count. It was a concession, not an election. You may have voted for Bush, but you didn't elect him.

Posted by: Rob Matsushita at February 4, 2002 02:24 PM

>>Vanna weeps silently at the sight of her hook.

Ah, I feel much more centred now....

Posted by: synchronicity at February 4, 2002 02:28 PM

Rob-
Just like you, I just posted for the first time in the soapbox, the place where this abortion discussion should really be taking place, not here in the comments.

Posted by: ingojax5 at February 4, 2002 02:34 PM

on a happier note, "Toy Soldiers" is on cable right now, but wil's character just bit the big one.

and what ever happened to keith coogan?

Posted by: courtney at February 4, 2002 02:47 PM

I'll keep my rant short.

Abortion is NOT birth control. If you use it in that way, that is just plain wrong.

A choice is just that, a choice. Free country, all that jazz. Pro-choicers do not tell people to abort their fetuses, they tell them they have a choice.

that. is. all.

Posted by: Courtney at February 4, 2002 02:54 PM

Sylvain said:

>> I think having babies is a purely selfish act in the first place. Potential parents seem to forget about overpopulation and dwindling resources when they decide to breed.

This post hits it squarely on the numbers for me.

I have one kid and she is the best, bestest, best in the world.

But...

Our priorities as a species are all wrong.

Having kids -- as many as possible -- made sense for the progation of our species for about 99.9% of our time on this rock.

That was then.

Party's over now.

Nothing wrong with having kids in and of itself, just like there is nothing wrong with pumping oil or cutting down trees.

A lumberjack is just a guy who cuts down a tree. What's wrong with that?

Nothing.

Unless it's the last tree.

Nothing wrong with being a fisherman.

Unless it's the last fish.

Nothing wrong with being a parent.

Unless you ignore overpopulation, a crisis apparent to all but the most starry-eyed zealots.

Jesus will clean up our mess.

I think I'll squeeze out a couple more.

Why?

Hell.

Cause I jes likes kids!

Yippee!

And...

They look sooooo cute in their jammies.

Instead of shitting on the heads of those who choose not to have children and deriding them as deviant, selfish, and subversive, we ought to be thanking them, because even if you have kids, somebody else is sucking it up so you don't have to concern yourself with unpleasantries.

Childless couples ought to be the ones receiving tax breaks. I'm not saying we should force anyone to not have children, but if that day does come -- as I believe it must -- it will be because of all the "family-friendly" parents who hoovered up somebody else's share of the planet in complete defiance of CONTEXT.

Everyone ought to read this book.

"Maybe One: A Case for Smaller Families"
by Bill Mckibben
http://www.powells.com/cgi-bin/biblio?inkey=1-0452280923-4

Shit.

I'll BUY you a copy if that's what it takes.

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 02:55 PM

Uh oh, *another* Courtney?

Ack.

Posted by: Courtney at February 4, 2002 02:55 PM

And don't tell me to take my ass to the Soapbox.

I'm Shaq.

If I don't gets my bow-room, I'll clear it my damned self.

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 02:57 PM

Misspelled propagation.

I need an EDIT feature!

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 03:01 PM

wilbur, I have only one thing to say to your comments about bush:

Shut up you f'in Naderite.

and you know the spirit in which I say that.

>:-)

Posted by: jbay at February 4, 2002 03:01 PM

AHEM!?!?!

Okay, as resident Arch-Libertarian, I can't let someone just pass by with commenting snidely that Dubbieya is a Libertarian.

Um, no. Actual libertarians (not just republicans who want to distance themselves from the tycoons) believe quite emphatically and strongly that a woman's body is her own. Given any choice, libertarians will almost certainly take the one which leads to a more decentralized and less potent federal government. Dubya is NOT this, otherwise our budget would have been cut by ~70% this year.

Vive la Tenth Amendment.

(what a heckuva way to introduce myself onto a mainly liberal board, by showing up as the uber-conservative...)

Posted by: Gustavus II Adolphus at February 4, 2002 03:03 PM

Shit.

We've got abortion on the table... I might as well blow this thing wide open.

"Pediatric group endorses gay adoptions"
http://www.cnn.com/2002/HEALTH/02/04/gay.adoption.ap/index.html

Not only do gay parents make "good adoptive parents," they make the best parents PERIOD.

They're typically highly educated, with a higher income to devote to their children. They tend to have smaller families and they adopt.

Win, win, win all around.

The opposition to gay couples stems from the nasty, long-held belief that gays are latent pedophiles, promiscuous, and prone to prancing about in leather with day-glo nipple clamps.

Yup.

And all black mens likes to rape white girls.

But go to the poll on CNN.com today and you'll see that 54% answer no to this question...

"Can gay couples make good adoptive parents?"

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 03:15 PM

damn you, jbay. I had to do your job in Soapbox.

there was a thread begging for a "shut up, you tea drinking fuck" and so I had to post it.

Posted by: Gigi at February 4, 2002 03:17 PM

Blah blah blah. I won Bloggies. Blah blah blah. It's a good thing, because you'll never win an Emmy or a Grammy. Enough of the self advertising already. It makes you look an even bigger prick.

Posted by: Googly Goo at February 4, 2002 03:21 PM

Yes, that's right, we shouldn't use abortion for birth control, especially multiple times...I'm all for making people take responsibility for their actions. Because that's a much better alternative for everyone involved - man, those people will make awesome parents.

Sure.

Posted by: buffyspazz at February 4, 2002 03:28 PM

I have found that the phrase "shut up, you tea-drinking fuck" can be use more than once per day. By the way, gigi, you Canukians sure drink a lot of tea, don't you. I think you know where I'm going with this.

Posted by: jbay at February 4, 2002 03:32 PM

I don't mean to come off attacking anyone, but I have to agree with the whole fetus as a person bit. Of course, that's what makes America great isn't it? That we can agree to disagree.

Posted by: Brian at February 4, 2002 03:33 PM

ANNOUNCEMENT:
If ww ever wins a Grammy, I promise I will personally eat the award statuette on pay-per-view television. Now an Emmy, I wouldn't rule out.

liable to cause indigestion.

Posted by: jbay at February 4, 2002 03:36 PM

Tammy - you missed my point. My point is that WE don't elect our president. We (all of us) elect someone to ultimately make that decision for us - the members of the Electoral College. By the majority of individual votes,though, Al Gore won the election. This is not a joke, and this has nothing to do with "the votes need to be recounted in Florida" blah blah blah. The final count of the popular vote (our individual votes counted, not state by state, but one by one without regard to state) has Al Gore beating George Bush by 500,000 votes or so. That's my point.

Posted by: Nayir at February 4, 2002 03:40 PM

...and then after the smoke is cleared, and the rubble has been swept away, me and Spudnuts will peek out our heads. We've been watching the riots on a monitor twenty floors below sea level, frum a bunker.

We did it. We beat the bastards of City Hall!

But now what will we do?

We must rebuild.

But who will lead us in the rebuilding process?

Man, it's got to be someone with the know-how and the elbow grease to lead us to a new land. No, not me and Spudnuts, we don't have the cognitive capacity to lead...

Allright! We'll do it!

We'll lead as two kings...

Posted by: Fraize at February 4, 2002 03:42 PM

But go to the poll on CNN.com today and you'll see that 54% answer no to this question...

"Can gay couples make good adoptive parents?"

That's because 54% of people are assholes.

Posted by: buffyspazz at February 4, 2002 03:44 PM

But Buffy, the primary organization of pediatricians issued an opinion today that gay adoption should be legalized because it's good for the kids.

Every cloud has a silver lining, to quote a trite phrase.

I'm from Boston, not the biggest Patriots fan, but I always appreciate it when they win. It's very exciting that they won last night, though, especially by such a close margin!

Last week, I was told that the Justice Department spent $8,000 to buy drapes to cover up a half-nude female statue representing justice. Apparently Ashcroft was tired of issuing statements with a bare breast peeping over his shoulder.

Anyone up for ordering a specially made Hooters t-shirt and sending it to the attorney general?

I only saw you in Stand by Me, Wil, but I really enjoyed it.

Glad to see you online, mate. Take care.

Posted by: Saladin at February 4, 2002 03:57 PM

Next CNN poll...

http://lakerbago.com/misc/wilpoll.jpg

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 04:03 PM


Hot Soup Girl:

Like you, I try to practice safe sex. Right now, it's oral sex only. We stand at opposite ends of the room and yell "Screw you" and "Up yours" etc.
.. maybe that should be called 'Aural Sex' ??

Posted by: TheCharlie at February 4, 2002 04:23 PM

leesten, meester bai, donut make me use my relation to a certain wallpaper pinup bear (all hail kurvybear's ass, the maple leaf state) to send the wrath of kai to your house. or telephone.
where did those soundfiles go?

i think this convo needs d'ohnut, the purple gaseous god. ;-)

Posted by: Gigi at February 4, 2002 04:23 PM

Dammit, Spudnuts, I can't get that damn poll to work.

Anyone remember that Denis Leary tune? "I'm an Asshole"...

Posted by: Courtney at February 4, 2002 04:25 PM

Okay, Spudnuts... you offered to buy that book so people would stop having kids. I know of several of my students who could use a copy. Shall I send my address?

And while we are all at it... Anyone wanna start a money pool for Vanna, so she can have a fake hand instead of a hook? It must hurt to wipe her ass.

Cera

Posted by: Cera at February 4, 2002 04:36 PM

Oh and on the next CNN poll... What if we all voted that we were Wil just for shits and giggles.

Posted by: Cera at February 4, 2002 04:38 PM

I ain't buying copies for your students.

This is an offer which applies only to underpriveleged posters at WWDN what are prone to getting their jimmies and/or coochies into situations likely to cause children-happening.

If that's you, then step right up.

Here's my addy:
[email protected]

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 04:47 PM

Wow. I can't really contribute much at this point, but kudos to everyone for this discussion. Very, very cool.

Especially to Spudnuts. You rock, and sum up what I'd want to say much better than I could.

'Nuff said.

Posted by: djwudi at February 4, 2002 04:50 PM

If you buy gasoline you support terrorism. It all comes down to oil. Now, some of you might think that George Walker-Lindh Bush, Jr. is an oil man, but that's not entirely the truth.

He's a failed oil man, much like Ken Lay, with the same insider stock sell off, but for much less money. $2,000,000 is still less than $30,000,000. Considering this, I can say with full confidence that GWLB is not supporting terrorism--but only because he couldn't even balance a piggy-bank for profit, let alone the budget.

Welcome to the great leap backwards. Can anyone here who actually supports Bush say that their life was better--especially on the grounds that they support him--than it was two years ago?

I thought not,

Aleph

Posted by: Aleph Null at February 4, 2002 04:53 PM

Nayir - you're correct; I did miss your point about electoral colleges. I skim through most of these comments (there are far too many to read in detail) and, um, didn't read yours properly, I guess. I don't necessarily agree with the part about Gore winning the popular vote, but I *do* see what you were saying in your comments.

Posted by: tammy at February 4, 2002 04:56 PM

Also,

It bears mentioning that Adolph Hitler:

a)Rose to power by manipulating election laws.

b)Was an enormously popular wartime "president".

Aleph

Posted by: Aleph Null at February 4, 2002 04:57 PM

Spudnuts:
Until now, I thought you might be Pat "Seig Heil" Buchanan, but if you were I suppose you'd be offering copies of "The Death of the West", which touches on the "how many kids" subject.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/694537.asp

Posted by: synchronicity at February 4, 2002 05:00 PM

I didn't vote for George. I chose the lesser of two evils, then got on a plane and flew to England, where I read all about the fiasco every day on the front page of the Times... how embarassing.

Posted by: kendoka at February 4, 2002 05:04 PM

Pat Buchanan is in the White House.

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 05:10 PM

>Pat Buchanan is in the White House.

Why, that gives me goose steps, er, goose bumps.

Posted by: synchronicity at February 4, 2002 05:25 PM

I can't wait till globalization takes hold

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 05:48 PM

Tammy, I have another question for you. (And I so don't mean this as a flame and I apologize profusely right now if it comes off that way. I'm truly interested in what you have to say. I'm all about healthy debate. :) ) What do you mean that you don't agree with the fact that Gore won the popular vote? I mean, when the votes were counted he came out ahead. In fact, that was one of the big issues while the votes were coming in, wasn't it? There was concern that the popular vote and the electoral votes would come out to favor different people, and that's what happened. Electoral to Bush and Popular to Gore. I'm interested in your reasonings behind how Gore didn't win the popular vote? (And again, I apologize if this sounds like a flame, because it's truly not how I meant it.)

Posted by: Nayir at February 4, 2002 06:02 PM

Dude, you're my hero, Wil.

And that ain't sarcasm, buddy.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 06:17 PM

Well I did not vote for HIM either! Also I beleive that "GOOGLY GOO"s post makes a good
point for abortion..as in "intellectual quota"
or survival of the species...weeding out process
so to speak...nuff said
Spudnuts you rock!!! In fact YOU are one of the
best reasons to visit WWDN..Aw shucks I guess
I have a crush on your mind...

Did anyone like U2 yesterday? (I did)

Posted by: bluecat-redblanket at February 4, 2002 06:22 PM

Is there a single fucking American on this shit hole? I see lots of people who live in a false word where everything is beautiful and if I don't hurt you, you won't hurt me. Face it there are some VERY EVIL bastards in the world that do not deserve to live for the greater good. To bad all you bleeding heart liberals can't get past your pacifists nose to see that. You people who think we shouldn't fight terrorism are going to be the death of this country. Instead of holding the door for somebody today why don't you get proactive for this country and quit drinking the liberal kool-aid. try supporting our troops who are defending this country so all you fucking pansys can whine about Bush being president and making little SNL style quips about him while you chug down more kool-aid.

DWD

Posted by: Darkwing Duck at February 4, 2002 06:25 PM

DWD,
Your a war mongering fool
Your type of people will have nukes pointed at the US and possiably have the world in radioactive death.

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 06:34 PM

Emma Peel:

THANKS for pointing out how poorly we really are doing in Texas, The Shrub has done all he can to help his friends. (Michael Moore's latest rant at www.michaelmoore.com about Bush & Enron is salient!)

I am a state employee, been one now for 14 years, I work in Human services at a residential facility that serves 365 adults with mental retardation and other disabilities and we are HURTING... our budget got slammed since The Shrub took office and Rick Perry (he who wishes to brand us with his Gov'nor ads!) ain't helping matters. I literally go begging for needed furniture and electronics through the State Surplus site.

I'm watching The Shrub's cronies trying to privitize all STATE services....which would be ok if they were even comparable but they are NOT!!! We've had more deaths of folks in private runs homes than in the State institutions...we take pride in being there for those who depend on us, even when our own State government disses us. We would not have even gotten a raise last fiscal if not for the McConley 7 who broke out and made a huge media stink for the State...you will hear about our State getting it's ASS sued off soon for doing something wrong in our human services systems... it's not a measure of how now, it's only "when" - which is scary!

I also like to remind people that he and his kin, ARE NOT TEXANS!!! Rich carpetbaggers... who came and made a "residence" in Texas since WE DON'T HAVE A STATE TAX!!! Bums!
Some people vote for those with the names... we all need to rise up and join those causes we truly believe in, no matter what the party so we can try and salvage the values of this country... get involved, vote!

-- B. Martin, the soverign State of Texas

Posted by: Beej Martin at February 4, 2002 06:35 PM

Oh, and I just finished reading the comments. Spudnuts, I'm in love.

I'd touch on the abortion debate, but if I do I'll get all huffy and stuff, and that'll give me a stomachache, and that won't be good.

Suffice to say, I'll stick with the pro-choice camp.

Dubya's sadly lacking in the qualifications department.

I have no idea what to do about a "war on drugs", especially when the phrase itself makes me want to vomit. Which reminds me - "war on terrorism"? Excuse me, my lunch is threatening to come up. This whole thing makes me ill. Goddangit.

Great, defecit spending. As if the 80s weren't bad enough. Thank you, Dubya, you weren't enough of an idiot, you had to go and prove it again. Let me repeat just in case history hadn't spoken for itself - trickle-down economics is bullcrap. Defecit spending = crap. YEARG.

Ok, that went on a lot longer than planned.

In any case, I'm in love with Spudnuts, until he says something I don't like, in which case I will either stop loving him or forget he said the offensive thing.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled browsing.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 06:38 PM

Oh, and DWD - dude, I'm American. I hate kool-aid. So, in the words of Mike from Frumpy the Clown -

"YOU MUST CHILL!"

Thank you.

On second thought - yes, there are nasty people in the world. They do indeed suck.

But there's something to be said for people who feel the need to remind others of this fact, others who are well-aware of it.

And when they're warned with bad grammar and spelling?... come on, man, you can do better.

So, DWD, my challenge to you is this: get your head out of your poorly-educated rear and start thinking for a change.

On a more pleasant note, I don't have class this week.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 06:44 PM

Gaea,
No worries. If hours wants to flame me for what I wrote, then by all means, that HIS RIGHT as a human being, He may not agree, that's HIS RIGHT as a person, He may also not be INFORMED of what is actually going on around him. Is that his right? Yes, it is.

However, I am of the opinion that ignorance is never an excuse.
Many people who post that members of the Military are 'Baby Killers' are just plain ignorant.
I bet the Vets would have gotten more than they did if the civilian populace LIKE Hours had given them the credit they deserved.
I'm by no means trying to shove anything down anyone's throat.
If I was, you'd know.
What I was doing, however, was enlightening those who ARE ignorant.
That is how we learn, is through the knowledge of others.
~Kaylin

Posted by: Kaylin at February 4, 2002 07:06 PM

Despite Bush's handling of Sept. 11th, which I still support, WE are now a nation divided in half between Bush and Clinton. Don't let those loving 80+% Bush ratings fool you because Bush Daddy fell for that trap before he got beat by Clinton, the Govenror of Arkansas. Yes, I say all of this because I love Wil.

Posted by: adeversole at February 4, 2002 07:13 PM

Despite Bush's handling of Sept. 11th, which I still support, WE are now a nation divided in half between Bush and Clinton. Don't let those loving 80+% Bush ratings fool you because Bush Daddy fell for that trap before he got beat by Clinton, the Govenror of Arkansas. Yes, I say all of this because I love Wil.

Posted by: adeversole at February 4, 2002 07:13 PM

My eyes burn, but my brain is happy.

135 comments, and only 3 complety idiotic flames.
Way to go, people! you all rule, regardless of your politics.

And for the record, I'm not a Democrat. I'm currently Independent, with Libertarian leanings... I want a smaller government that keeps itself out of my house, and isn't wasting my money.

And I, too, think that Spudnuts is the best thing about WWDN.

Word.

Posted by: wil at February 4, 2002 07:29 PM

"And when they're warned with bad grammar and spelling?..." KJB

I have found that those who use this to help defend their position don't have much of a position to begin with and just need SOMETHING to validate their side. But hey, nice try!

Obviously I do need to re-educate you on the events of September 11th. These assholes are not going away and while I was at work today (that's right folks, some of us have to work to help support the lazy fuckers in this country) the terrorists all over the world were thinking of new ways to bring another September 11th upon us. Unless we do something proactive against them then this country is truly defeated.

I find it interesting you mention school...I suppose that since you listen to some facist, bleeding heart professor all day, who only wishes they had a strong bead on things that you to thru osmosis or tactial contact have also picked up this false wisdom. You are not enlightened nor do you have any idea how the real word operates or thinks.

JENN - You are a pacifist fool. My "type" is the only reason why there is a country called The United States of America. Laying down and not fighting for your country has never won a war. Had the colonsits said screw it I'll pay the tax and never rose up against King George we would have heard Mariah Carey singing a horrible remdition of "God Save the Queen". Educate yourself a little bit on nuclear weapons and war and it will make a world of difference for you. Mutual destruction has kept this world save since World War II. Had the US never developed or dropped nuclear weapons on Japan, the Allies would of had to enter Japan on foot and millions of soldiers would have been killed in the battle and there is no real proof that the Axis powers could of won the war. Watch the History channel once in a while, it really is educational.

I'm having an awesome day.

DWD

Posted by: Darkwing Duck at February 4, 2002 07:33 PM

Kelly V-


"Wait a second, Trapper Keepers were the thing when I was in early elementary which puts it sometime around '85 or earlier, too. I had my Batman shirt when I was in about 4th grade which makes THAT about '86...."


I'm talking about the Michael Keaton Batman that came out in the summer of '89. And the last year I bought a Trapper Keeper was for the 88-89 school year (cuz the next year I entered H.S.).



Speaking of the 1980's, what ever happened to Chad Allen? I was never a fan of his, but visiting WWDN has made wonder about other 1980's T.V. "Heart Throbs" that used to grace the pages of Tiger Beat and Bop! Which I only read for the hard hitting journalism :-)

Posted by: Kimberly3 at February 4, 2002 07:36 PM

DWD,
I completely agree with your statement about there being some "very evil bastards" out there (I read the papers and study history too, bud). Being a Bush critic doesn't make a person nieve, a pacifist, opposed to the fight against terrorism, or a "fucking pansys [sic]" either.

You see, reactions like yours are why people are upset with the "with us or against us".

Posted by: synchronicity at February 4, 2002 07:38 PM

Dubya opens doors only he can see. Ain't politics a hoot.

Posted by: Fred Fowler at February 4, 2002 07:40 PM

Oh, this is going to be fun.

DWD, I hate to break it to you, but it's kind of hard to be a fascist and a bleeding-heart at the same time. Weird, I know, but that's how it works.

I also find your comment about using language as a weak validation to be one of the silliest things I've ever heard, and I've heard a lot, being a non-Catholic at a Catholic school. Language is what humans use to communicate, as a rule. If it's used poorly, then the person who's trying to communicate with it isn't doing as good a job as they could be doing.

Good for you for working. Of course, that gives you no right to bash others for commenting on this board, as I'm sure you were hinting. No one likes to be called a "lazy fucker". That kind of comment makes very few friends; then again, that's probably not your aim here.

As to the re-education you speak of? Please don't bother. If this event were to go anything like your recent comments, well then, I have no intention of sticking around listening to someone who has so much contempt for his fellow man.

Hell, a little revolution may not be a bad thing at all, but let's think about this. Violent retaliation for something that was done for that express purpose, to show how badbadbad the USA is? I don't know what the proper response to 9/11 is, but I'm pretty damn sure that what we're doing isn't the greatest idea ever concieved.

Then again, I don't have any suggestions. Well, no, wait. I'd have to go with the choice on winamp.com - kick bin Laden in the nuts repeatedly.

So, to finish, I apologize to Wil for making this into a flamewar-type thing. You rule, dude.

At least a liberal education encourages thinking.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 07:46 PM

Hmmm... forget Trapper Keepers and Chad Allen. The best thing about the 80s was in 1987, when I escaped from the seventh circle of Hell that was the Catholic School I attended during my formative years.

*shudders*

Posted by: kendoka at February 4, 2002 07:49 PM

I agree with Wil... let em stop waisting my money !!!

Dont get scared people, that a REALLY old link, to a really old home page :) But those are my blessings in life :)
Amy

Posted by: Amy at February 4, 2002 07:49 PM

And when i say old, I mean it.... I was still married then !

Posted by: Amy at February 4, 2002 07:51 PM

DWD,
War of 1812.....Vietnam....Oh yeah US rules! I rather be able to sing "God Save the Queen" if it means that other countrys hate me and want me dead for living in a country that likes to play the King of the world. I have nothing against defending our country...I DO have a problem when defending turns into lets just be a big ass bully towards countrys who do and say things we don't agree with. And if you don't know anything about the war of 1812....ASK some CANADIANs....they love reminding people of that lovely little speed bump in American US history.

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 07:56 PM

Go CANADA ....You guys kicked our (USA) butts!! Love ya crazy Canucks!

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 07:58 PM

At least a liberal education encourages thinking. KJB

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!! Funniest comment I've heard all evening, and I've been watching CNN! A liberal education (isn't that an oxymoron?) isn't an education, all that your "taught" is no matter how hard you work you can't help yourself but if you give me your hand I can help you brother. The whole foundation of liberalism requires that a people believe that the liberals are needed to be in control for the average person to get ahead. You are a slave to the liberals, can't you see that? You don't need liberals to get ahead in life, they need you! As long as you buy into there ideology you will be there slave and there only foot hold! Liberals say they are "the peoples party" NO, "the people are the liberals party". As soon as liberal supporters see that it is really themselves who have the power and not the liberal controllers then you can get ahead in life and business.

I have walked thru the valley of the shadow of the liberals...WWDN.

DWD

Posted by: Darkwing Duck at February 4, 2002 08:02 PM

So how do you propose we sort through this whole mess, DWD?

Posted by: kendoka at February 4, 2002 08:06 PM

You know what I believe in kendoka, to borrow a line from the Godfather, "I believe in America". As much as the government would love us to believe that they can stimulate the economy, we the people have the real power (as it should be). As life returns to normal people will start to buy again and invest and in a short time the economy will stabalize and we will enter another bull market. You can blame Bush for the economy but the economy was crashing while Clinton was still in office. I can't believe I'm saying this but it wasn't ALL Clintons fault either. Between the Dot Com crazy and later bust the market had a huge influx of new investors which took stocks that were $.15 on Monday at 10:00 am to $50.00 by lunch. When the lack of profits and lack of an actual business plan started hitting investors they all said "Holy shit what was I thinking, how can you buy a bag of dog food for $10.00 and sell it for $8.00 and make a profit"?! So many started to sell and a vast majority of dot coms went bankrupt and all the money in the market was flushed out which we are just now getting over the backlash of it. The only thing that will heal the economy is people buying again which will create jobs which in turn people will buy more stuff and on and on and the capitalism machine will start cooking again. And that is my free seminar on the economy.

The War on Terrorism. Well, it's a shit job but somebody has to do it. Other then the countrys that actually harbor terrorists I don't hear any bitching from the developed nations of the world. I'm just an average joe and I fully believe we are doing the right thing as does 86% of my fellow Americans. I don't know what I would do different if anything. I think staying the course and eliminating these sons of bitches is the only resonable course of action. You cannot reason with people who don't respect there own life let alone the lives of others.

DWD

Posted by: Darkwing Duck at February 4, 2002 08:22 PM

Well, the next time I buy into "there" ideology, I'll let you know, DWD. You are certainly my source for The Truth.

That is, if The Truth can come from some who is so angry at the world. Geez, I thought I could be cynical.

This all makes me wonder - if liberals and their supposedly bleeding-heart ways bother you so much, and make your panties get in such a twist, then why are you visiting WWDN and this board in the first place?

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 08:23 PM

Why does the US feel that it and it alone knows whats best. "I don't hear any bitching from the developed nations of the world" Well DWD I live in Canada...though I am from the USA and I hear plenty of the other nations problems on the war. For one they don't like that the US is not considering the prisoners POW's which they are.If there isn't any complaining loud enough for you to hear it is because the US likes to be a dick to any country who disagrees with it. And if the mighty US doesn't like something they like changing the rules. The US has to stop acting like a spoiled brat child and act like a mature person in the world. This isn't a game of Cowboys and indians that Bush is playing. I want the military to defend me not start wars for me.

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 08:35 PM

Someone has to set all you wayward spirits straight, if I wasn't here it would be a liberal free for all. You guys would be killing babys, turning gay and raising taxes if I wasn't here to inject a little intelligence into the group.

Cynical, you bet. Angry, hardly. Frustrated, definately. Giving up, HELL NO!

I just find it funny that all the democrats do is slam businesses like there is some kind of alternative, actually there is, it's called Amish. Funny though, I've seen lots of Amish Cheese Shops and Amish Furniture stores so I guess you have to have money even if you have a horse and buggy.

Why don't I drink the liberal punch? It must be the fact that I didn't grow up in the liberals biggest bitch, California.

DWD, the Conservative Defender of WWDN!

Posted by: Darkwing Duck at February 4, 2002 08:40 PM

Ok, now I'm pretty sure you're nuts.

For one, I'm not a terribly patriotic person, or anything like that. I do take offense, however, at bashing the state of California. Don't make me get up on your ass about that.

I don't recall having slammed businesses and promoting an Amish way of life. However, if you're making fun of them... dude, at least they're not being an ass like you.

Which reminds me for some reason - CA gave the USA Ronnie Reagan. Just remember that next time you say California's a liberal hideyhole of sin and corruption. No, I'm not proud of that fact, but at least it's not the state of bleeding hearts you claim it is. Ugh.

And for the last goddamn time, I don't drink punch.

The United States of America is not perfect. Deal with this fact. We are not God's gift to Creation, assuming there is a God in the Judeo-Christian sense.

So please, chill, before you make a bigger fool of yourself than you have already.

(I can so see where this will go. "Your the ass!!!!1" Ahhh, for the breakdown of the English language...)

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 08:50 PM

DWD.There should be no place for terrorism in the world, but there are terrorists. Why? Not simply for the sake of hating and killing. They have reasons why they do what they do.(NONE of which I agree with.) As soon as we open our eyes as to why they attack us, we will be better able to defeat them. Basically the USA just stomps all over the world thinking it can do whatever it wants to whatever country it wants without repercussion. Look at the axis-of-evil statement. The US has the largest stockpile of nuclear and biological weapons in the world. It's okay for the US to own and manufacture these weapons, but nobody else can. The US can intervene in other countries politics, but nobody else can. Of course the US is hated around the world! We act like we own the entire planet!
I am not a liberal, nor a democrat nor a republican, nor a conservative. Labels or for the feeble-minded.

Posted by: Sylvain at February 4, 2002 08:50 PM

Oh, and take the homophobia elsewhere.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 08:50 PM

What would be nice would be if the entire U.S. population was not blamed for the actions (or inactions) of its elected officials.

Posted by: kendoka at February 4, 2002 08:51 PM

Wil,

I think will playing the Abortion Card shows you are frustrated with Bush's Popularity.

I mean as a topic of discussion, its Religion and Politics all wrapped up in one. It is a very emotional issue similar to using Race in the OJ trial.

Its like complaining about our Electoral College system; doesnt really seem to carry as much weight if you only complain after your candidate lost, or in this case the candidate you hate no matter what won.

If you felt so strongly about the choice issue, why didnt you speak up sooner?


Posted by: bluesman at February 4, 2002 08:51 PM

DWD,
Uh...no. I think that I grew up in a military family in Virginia. Yeah good ole Virginia....The southern part at that. ;P
Jenn, Defender of a Free thinking Brain!

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 08:52 PM

Wil...

I think you should post again so you can let this thread move onward toward it's death.

;-)

Someone vote for the AntiBloggies for Fark's sake.

Remember the cheese!

And the Matsusshsdfhsghskhgshita and SpudNads and JSc. Or something.

Posted by: Roughy at February 4, 2002 08:54 PM

>...though I am from the USA and I hear plenty >of the other nations problems on the war.

>For one they don't like that the US is not >considering the prisoners POW's which they >are.

Actually the Geneva Convention doesn't protect militant groups and gorillas. So they are not protected under the Geneva Convention. Facts are Facts.

>If there isn't any complaining loud enough for >you to hear it is because the US likes to be a >dick to any country who disagrees with it.

This goes for any country, but you can tag it to however you want I guess.

>And if the mighty US doesn't like something >they like changing the rules.

Really? Can you give me some examples?

>The US has to stop acting like a spoiled brat >child and act like a mature person in the >world. This isn't a game of Cowboys and indians >that Bush is playing.

Your right, and do you think Bush is calling all the shots? He has the best military strategists and officers in the world under his command and I'm sure that they give him directions and he constantly is consulting with them. And I'm sure that they know what to do better then some American turned Canadian. This is why we elect the people we think can do the best job, for situations just like this.

>I want the military to defend me not start wars >for me.

So it was the US Military that flew those planes into the WTC?! I thought it was Arab Terrorists. Face it, we didn't start this war but we are going to end it. 3000 fellow Americans are killed on US soil and you think too bad, but we shouldn't do anything about it? It's a shame that your patriotism and love of country has waned so much.

DWD

Posted by: Darkwing Duck at February 4, 2002 08:59 PM

ok and this is why I am not into politics because it make you crazy!!! Abortion- it's the woman's right to not have to have a child that wasn't planned regadless of what the situation is rich, poor,druggie/clean. We are a nation that has our teenagers thowing their children away in dumpsters and bathrooms at proms.Or worse they have the kids they can't care for and they lock them into closets- yay America? however I am an American, And a mother of two- yet my own sis who is older then me can't even get pregnate-and no healthcare like medicaid will help her-because they are trying to keep from having to pay for another bill of teen pregnancy, so she is screwed.and her job doesn't cover this sort of thing-but its her only job avalable.As for me i am I guess liberal- so their it is Labled! I hate lables.*CA-ChUnk!* yes I know always late to the party-and all fired up now what have i gotten myslef into?

Posted by: Andie at February 4, 2002 09:00 PM

What is the *goal* of an abortion? The goal is for a woman to no longer be pregnant. The woman doesn't want a child or can't raise a child for *whatever* reason. The reason is not important as it is based on a person's value system which varies greatly amongst us since we all have different cultural, religious, educational, social, and financial backgrounds. Forget about the actual reason. It is sufficient to say that a person will weigh the facts (based on their personal values) and conclude that a reason is "valid" or "invalid".Because we all have different values, it is extremely likely that at least one person, weighing a given set of facts, will conclude the reason is valid whilest another person weighting the same set of facts will conclude the reason "invalid". We will *never* have the exact same set of values, thus, we can't agree.

Going back to the original goal, the woman is pregnant and no longer wants to be. Why do people try to force their own set of values onto this woman? "Because we want to protect the rights of the baby.", they argue. Then everybody starts arguing about whether a little clump of cells is actually a baby. *Whatever* your opinion is, it doesn't matter. Again, *your* opinion is based on the above-mentioned values. You all will *never* agree.

Back to the original goal: The woman no longer wants to be pregnant. So, how do we accomplish this goal? The only method that I have heard of so far is abortion. Here's an alternative: The mother goes into a clinic, requests that the fetus be removed, signs some papers, pays a fee, and then the doctor removes the fetus from the woman's body at that time. The woman has achieved the goal. What happens to the fetus? Simple. If the fetus has developed enough to live outside of its host (the woman), then it should be allowed to continue living in private care facilities and eventually be put up for adoption. If the fetus was not developed enough to live without a host body, then it dies. To me, the decision about whether a fetus is a child or not has always been about whether it can exist without requiring a host. *That* is the definition of an *individual* and isn't this all about an *individual's* rights? For those who keep using the terms "child" and "baby" to refer to a clump of unborn cells, try to realize that those terms do not accurately describe what it is. Child refers to something that is a lot more complex than a baby which is a lot more complex than a fetus which is a lot more complex than sperm and ova. You cannot use these terms interchangably. You *cannot* think clearly and reasonably about an issue when you don't use well defined terminology.

Bush ... why are people saying how "great" and "popular" Bush is just because polls show that Americans approve of attacking terrorists who attacked us first? The poll simply means that people approve of retaliation. However, it feels like Bush is starting to overstep his bounds. He said that his presidency will be entirely about winning the war against terrorism. The scary part is that once the "obvious" terrorists are eliminated, how will the definition of "terrorist" be expanded to include the less-obvious terrorists and when will that expansion stop. (Eventually ... "Did you just *say* something negative about our government --- you are a potential terrorist and must be dealt with.") I keep thinking, wasn't Hitler popular with the German people, at first?

Posted by: BriGuy at February 4, 2002 09:11 PM

>Ok, now I'm pretty sure you're nuts.

I'm pretty sure you don't agree with me so being on the other end of your ideology I would seem nuts as you do to me.

>For one, I'm not a terribly patriotic person, >or anything like that. I do take offense, >however, at bashing the state of California. >Don't make me get up on your ass about that.

Getting up on my ass? Yep, your from CA. alright. Actually I know lots of people from CA. and been there quite a few times, but it is still one of the most liberal states in the country.

>I don't recall having slammed businesses and >promoting an Amish way of life. However, if >you're making fun of them... dude, at least >they're not being an ass like you.

I'm not making fun of Amish people at all. Actually I respect the fact that they can stick to their convictions so well. But liberals in general point to big business and say there is your problem, go kill it! Now that is being an ass.

>Which reminds me for some reason - CA gave the >USA Ronnie Reagan. Just remember that next time >you say California's a liberal hideyhole of sin >and corruption. No, I'm not proud of that fact, >but at least it's not the state of bleeding >hearts you claim it is. Ugh.

Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while.

>And for the last goddamn time, I don't drink >punch.

Punch, Vodka, whatever.

>The United States of America is not perfect. >Deal with this fact. We are not God's gift to >Creation, assuming there is a God in the Judeo->Christian sense.

I'm very aware we are not perfect but there is no other country I would rather live in. About that last line, you've been watching Fight Club haven't you?


>So please, chill, before you make a bigger fool >of yourself than you have already.

Being a lone conservative in a room full of liberals of course I'm the fool. But if I wasn't then you guys wouldn't be doing a very good job of sticking up for your beliefs.

>(I can so see where this will go. "Your the >ass!!!!1" Ahhh, for the breakdown of the >English language...)

Not that you know me in any way shape or form. ASS!!!!!!!!!!

DWD

Posted by: Darkwing Duck at February 4, 2002 09:14 PM

Easy...."Free Trade Agreement" and the soft wood lumber dispute."our right, and do you think Bush is calling all the shots? He has the best military strategists and officers in the world under his command and I'm sure that they give him directions and he constantly is consulting with them. And I'm sure that they know what to do better then some American turned Canadian. This is why we elect the people we think can do the best job, for situations just like this" Ummmm Can we say Puppet And if I am not mistaken the war on Afganistan is pretty much a near done deal. The most the US should do is prevention actions not active war on countrys who haven't done anything to harm us. I think that the US has had its revenge for 9/11

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 09:15 PM

"So it was the US Military that flew those planes into the WTC?!"
They didn't STOP the planes, did they? There is very good evidence that suggest that they could have stopped the planes, but chose not to. There is very good evidence that they were warned about the attacks form other countries, but chose to ignore the warnings.There is very good evidence that all of it could have been prevented, but US gummint needed areason to go into Afghanistan to continue to aquire oil. There were many things that could have been done to prevent 9/11, but if that happened, we'd all be focused on the recession and how Bush really is a big dumb yokel. Nothing brings a country together like a common cause, such as war.Lil Bush learned well from his Pops about that.

Posted by: Suvau at February 4, 2002 09:16 PM

Wow, you guys rock. This has been the best conversation I've read/posted in on the ol' in-ter-net. ^_^

U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A!

Posted by: Courtney at February 4, 2002 09:18 PM

Abortion stinks....you wanna know why? Would you want to be aborted? I wouldn't.

Posted by: Cody at February 4, 2002 09:19 PM

Of course the Geneva Accords don't cover gorillas. Those are primates.

Now, guerillas, there's a group that might not be covered.

On the topic of Bush having people under his command... you really think he's calling the shots? My neurotic terrier could do a better job at calling the shots in this "war" than Dubya could, and the dog'll save hundreds of dollars on suits, too. People other than Bush are in charge of this business, and there are a lot of people out there who like the illusion that Dubya's in charge.

So, bring it on. I've come to the conclusion we won't agree on much, but hell, when has that stopped anyone from arguing?

Go Djibouti!

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 09:19 PM

In general, everyone seems to be putting quite a bit of thought into their posts (even though some of it is horribly skewed by political leanings, of course). Congrats.

Re: DWD's rantings in particular....

He brings up the classic example of noble americans in the 13 colonies refusing to pay a tax on tea, rising up, and overthrowing their British oppressors.

He neglects to mention that the Tea Tax amounted to a few percent, at most. He also neglects to mention that state and federal taxes combined currently take THOUSANDS of times more of americans' money than the tea tax ever did (note, this is adjusted for inflation, etc. I'm not making an idiotic attempt to compare pence to dollars.)

Where are those noble patriots now? They should be screaming from the hills, "No Taxation Without Representation!" since it's a foregone conclusion that the average american's opinion is little more than an gnat's buzzing to the average national political figure.

Me, I don't see many people at all leaping to do battle with the government. Instead, I see people hiding behind a cloak of false patriotism to avoid having to think for themselves.

Pathetic.

Patriotism is not blindly supporting your government. It is not rendering yourself insolvent in the interest of trying to prop up the economy even while the government commits itself to renewed deficit spending. It is not jumping on whatever bandwagon happens to be passing by. Patriotism is sitting, and thinking, and considering, and choosing to stand up for those things for which your nation was originally supposed to stand. Not McDonalds and Exxon and *.com and Microsoft and Starbucks. Patriotism does not include supporting the military when it invades some podunk third-world nation and starts killing civilians. Patriotism *DOES*, however, include supporting the troops who are attempting to do right by fighting for their country, however misguided a strategy may be.

Life. Liberty. Pursuit of happiness. Equality. Freedom of speech/religion/assembly/press. Freedom of THOUGHT. A government of the people, by the people, and for the people.

Vanna White's hook. (or not?)

Patriotism most of all includes fulfilling your responsibility as a citizen to let the government know when it's gone astray, either by voting or writing letters, or running for office (as futile as that may often seem), or just talking to people and attempting to spread knowledge and open people's eyes.

JSc

Posted by: JSc at February 4, 2002 09:22 PM

Cody,
Ummm...I think it is a lil after the fact to abort me or you....especially you. We are grown people that have lived and aquired knowledge....well some of us have.

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 09:25 PM

Re: abortion

My personal thought is that until you are put in a position where you are forced to make the hard decision of whether or not you or your wife is going to have an abortion, all your theories about "right" and "wrong" are no more than mental masturbation.

Yeah, it's great to say that every sperm is sacred, every sperm is good. But you know what? Until and unless you need to decide, you have no concept of how difficult a decision it must be, and as much as you'd undoubtedly love to say "well, *I* would never even consider aborting a fetus," you'll never know until you're actually put to the test.

As an obvious corollary, I don't know where I personally stand on abortion. I've never had to decide. I don't yet know if I'm strong enough to say, "well, my life will suck, but I'm going to take care of this kid." I'd like to say I'm able to handle anything that comes along.

But I'm not idiot enough to even claim to know for sure.

JSc

Posted by: JSc at February 4, 2002 09:28 PM

I don't think it's my place to tell someone what to do or not to do with their body and what comes from it. I know I was totally unplanned. Then again, I know people who were addicted to drugs most of their lives, and if they'd had half the kids they'd gotten pregnant with in that time period, there'd be a lot more crack babies in the world.

No, I don't know you, DWD, and I'm glad I don't.

I don't drink vodka, either.

Wait, I do know you, sort of. I can tell that you don't like me, and that my picking at your language skills is probably bugging you, no matter how much you deny it here.

And no, I haven't seen Fight Club at all recently. I don't even remember that line from the movie. Sorry to burst your bubble there.

Here, let me give you a lesson in grammar.
"your"=possessive. It is your ball.
"you're"=you are. You are a person. You're a person.
Get it right, please.

Oh, and thanks for saying "ASS!!!!!!!!!!". You confirmed my theory.

Go Djibouti!

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 09:29 PM

Holy shitballs splattered on Jason Lee...

And to think I was bummed that I missed my laughs listening to Rush for 5 minutes- didn't know all I had to do was to tune in here to the wild rantings of little Limbaugh Jr; Mr. Duck.

Nifty.

So here's my two half pence (I'm a cheap date)...

I mentioned in yesterday's comments that I'm adopted.
The girl who had me was 16. In 1978 abortion was very much an option for this young lady but here I am thanks to the Catholic church and a understanding family (I won't get into leaving that church sincerely disgusted 13 years later- another story for another time).
Now with 23 years of experience behind me, my beliefs go like this.
You choose to have sex then you have to deal with the consequences. You have three choices- have it- kill it- or give it up.
Now you can all dress it up whatever way you like but you are terminating a life- much like stomping on a ant. You may not consider it a human life but you are killing it.
So I'm pro-life, I don't believe in abortion or the death penalty.
But just like I can't stop some wacko from shooting me on the street- I can't and won't stop someone from making a choice about what's growing inside them. People have to make a choice- So when it comes to other people, I'm Pro-Choice.

I guess I'm optimistic - my hope in humanity leaves me to believe that someday we'll turn away from our caveman instincts to rape and plunder our neighbors- our worshiping of property and material goods.. My hopes are ultimately utopian and perhaps they will never come to fruit. But that's what goals are all about.
But we live in reality so I have this advice for the here and now- Be a good citzen of the world, be sand not oil in the workings of the corrupt system. Question authority exspecially from the likes of Ashcroft and Bush jr.

And have a nice day...

Posted by: MissKittyFantastico at February 4, 2002 09:30 PM

That's my point? After you now have had the chance to live, would you not mind being aborted?

Of course you don't know at the time, but now.

Posted by: Cody at February 4, 2002 09:31 PM

woops, that ain't suppose to be a question mark.

Posted by: Cody at February 4, 2002 09:33 PM

Ooops...one last time....I also mean having been not being.

Posted by: Cody at February 4, 2002 09:35 PM

Cody,
fetus don't think they Humans in the making. I....as a fully and completely developed human have all the functions to think. It is like calling a tree a future chair

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 09:38 PM

Kitty, you're cool.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 09:39 PM

I don't view abortion as a form of birth control or murder; I see it as more of a hobby. You know, like stamp collecting or model railroads. Something fun you do in your spare time.

Posted by: Ron at February 4, 2002 09:44 PM

I understand that the fetus doesn't think, but that fetus will eventually be a fully thinking human being just like you and me.

And so basically you wouldn't have minded having been aborted as a fetus? You didn't think then so no harm done, right?

Posted by: Cody at February 4, 2002 09:44 PM

Well, if the "thinking" idea is going to be used as a reason against abortion, or something of that ilk, think about this:

We eat lots of eggs every year. Every one of those eggs could have been, in a different time and/or place, been a happy little chicken.

This is why I try not to make gross generalizations, and stick more to case-by-case evaluations.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 09:47 PM

KJB - I tend to type fast and often, but I do know what grammer to use in what situations, I just don't make it my job to point out every little error, it's very a very anal activity.

I just threw the "ass" comment in there to make your day.


JSC - Today taxes is used for many more things then back in colonial days. It costs a shit ton of money to maintain highways, schools, the military, government buildings, social programs etc. I don't mind paying some taxes as long as the return is worth the price. When we have a billion dollar surplus though, I tend to think that taxes is a bit high. That money is not the governments, it's the peoples. The government produces nothing to make that money but we all mutually (to a certain extent, the whole neccessary evil thing) agree that the money is for the greater good of out nation.

The government is well aware that we let them do what they do because it's our porrogative. At this point in time I don't see any reason for a mutiny on the bounty. But if even half of the US citizens (that's over 130,000,000 people) said these sons of bitches have gone far enough, do you really think the US government could stop them?

DWD

Posted by: Darkwing Duck at February 4, 2002 09:48 PM

Not that I'm saying you are. Everyone is welcome to their own opinion.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 09:48 PM

KJB,

Actually that's not true, because the eggs that go into production for consumption are never actually fertalized...meaning they're not capable of producing chicks.

Posted by: Cody at February 4, 2002 09:51 PM

I type quickly, too. You'll notice I'm not spelling it "grammer".

I realize it's an incredibly irritating thing to do. Normally, I don't bother people with it. What can I say, you bring out that side of me.

Thanks for the "ass" comment. You did make my day.

One thing to take into consideration - if there's a surplus, why is there a national debt? Why does our government pay out the ass for defense systems that don't work? Why is our crime rate so high? Why do we have an incredible number of people, especially children, living far below the poverty line? They can't all be lazy.

I'm going to go back to eating my liberal cookie, reading my liberal fiction novel, looking out of my liberal contacts, typing on my liberal computer, and thinking my nasty liberal thoughts.

Mmmm, cookie.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 09:58 PM

Cody -

I know. I'm just making a point. We've been eating fetuses and the like for millenia. Doesn't make it right, doesn't make it wrong. We eat the young of all kinds of animals.

Ooo, I suppose this means we are tampering with nature when we process those eggs. Yet another dark and dirty point.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 10:00 PM

I just want to say how refreshing it is to see such intelligent debate on such an emotion-provoking subject. Other places, like slashdot, usually break down into name calling, Christianity hating, mud slinging. So, if we could all give each other a big round of applause :)

My $0.02: I used to be COMPLETELY pro-life (anti-choice, callitwhatever), believing that abortion should not be allowed under any circumstance. Then, I got married and had two daughters. And, now I'm not so sure anymore (not because of the daughters of course!)

When I think about a scenario where one of my daughters is raped by the school janitor at her junior high school (a morbid thought, I know), I can't imagine making her carry any pregnancy that would result to term. Yeah, I'm pretty sure I would opt for the abortion in that case.

I still believe it IS the taking of a human life, but in that circumstance, that human life would not be as important to me.

Posted by: Joshua at February 4, 2002 10:01 PM

Just a quick comment on the whole abortion issue.

If you want to discourage abortion and encourage adoption - which for the record I believe is what should be done - make adoption easier.

Currently it costs upwards of ten THOUSAND dollars or more to adopt - and yes even to adopt an older child.

Officials say that money makes no difference in the adoption process, but it does. The costs are such that people like myself can't reasonably afford it.

I'm not saying that people shouldn't have to go thru the home studies and the background checks, etc, Im simply saying that perhaps if adoption was more accessible to the people who would make wonderful parents, but don't have a lot of money, then there would be less abortion.

Posted by: K2 at February 4, 2002 10:02 PM

Well said Joshua!
I too love how this debate is going...Though I find it hard to express myself intellectually clear. I am not one to write out on the computer alot.

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 10:06 PM

Wil, I love your page, its very very very impressive. Wil you fell way off the left wing to the point where you're almost a communist. I'm in the US military, and I'm not a quasi rich Californian like yourself. The increased defense spending will give me a pay increase, better health care, and other benefits. They will also keep your house in California SAFE!! My sister is a radically politically left winged like yourself, bashing the President and Republicans at any chance she can get, and takes Political Correctness and bitching about the dumbest shit that dosn't even pertain to her. Instead of bitching all the time about the President and our government, why can't you talk about what they are doing right. Yeah our country is not perfect, but its certainly not evil. If you complain so much about it, then why do you stay here? You call the President an Emporer, well why don't you go someplace like Somalia where there are real emporers? The people chose GWBush, you live in a Democracy, and you don't have it that bad, so stop your bitching.

Posted by: Brian Gerrard at February 4, 2002 10:10 PM

1. septic abortion deaths
2. backyard butchers
3. infanticide
4. tots in dumpsters
4. orphanages
6. gruel

you know, abortion wasn't always legal.

so, this isn't a purely hypothetical conversation we're having here. we've already been there, done that.


if we make abortions illegal, do people suddenly become more concerned about the sanctity of human life?

well, no. history has already shown us that that isn't the case. it has never stopped up from perpetrating other innummeral atrocities on our fellow man.

if we make abortions illegal, does every woman who's fallen accidentally pregnant (and is horrified by the situation) suddenly change her mind, tie on an apron and morph into 'world's #1 mother?'

take a wild guess.

if the idea of a woman bleeding to death in her own bath doesn't do anything for you, then try this:

gruel.

do you really want a world with more gruel in it?

Posted by: hot soup girl at February 4, 2002 10:10 PM

Just to throw a wrench into the works (and to mess with everyone's minds! MUAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!), consider the rape scenario in Joshua's post (two above mine, as I write this).

Kinda takes the entire concept of original sin to a new level. The child was conceived in sin, and is therefore unworthy of being born.

Alternatively, if your daughter carries the child to term, what about adoption? Oh, wait. Adoption is far less likely than a string of (possibly uncaring) foster homes. (Obviously, if a foster home is good, chances of the child going to another foster home afterward are smaller. Thus the "string of possibly uncaring foster homes" comment doesn't is in no way meant as an insult to those of you who reach out to such children.)

Or, of course, there's the possibility that your daughter carries the child to term and keeps it, thereby limiting her future options in terms of education, a job, etc. Note that I'm not saying anything about her marriage options. Any man who wouldn't happily marry a woman who already has a child if he loves her and the kid is clearly an utter cretin, and isn't worth the time of day....

Ponder. Then realize that you can't answer it until you really have to choose.

Posted by: JSc at February 4, 2002 10:12 PM

Hot Soup Girl rules.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 10:14 PM

Brian,
I don't think you Right wingers had any troubles vocally finding fault with a democrat in the white house....And I believe you guys were on a hunt to over throw him. Lets look what the basics of communism is....It is putting everybody on equal footing. No poor nor rich everyone working and taking care of. The only problem is that humans get involved and screw it up. Though the Us does have some communist systems.

Posted by: Jenn at February 4, 2002 10:17 PM

Yo, Darkwing:

I have no idea if you're still even reading at this point, but I thought I'd chime in--if for no other reason than because when I left the room, there were about HALF as many comments as there are now--a lot of them written by and directed at you.

I'm jumping on the bandwagon--and just like in the 80's, I'm doing it a little late.

First off, just curious: If you've got 86% of the American public backing you up, then, really, man, why so insecure, dude?

You think people didn't criticize FDR? Or Lincoln?

And not to burst your bubble, but you're not the lone Conservative Gunfighter in this here one horse DotNet. It's just that the others aren't real ready to leap to your defense as you keep referring to the people on this board as "lazy," "fuckers," or what-have-you.

A "United Front" does NOT mean keeping your mouth shut when you know something's wrong.

Are you honestly going to say that there is NOTHING suspicious about Enron?

Being clear-headed does not mean that we "just let the terrorists get away with it." Since 9/11, we've been hear a lot of talk about if we let (whatevere bad thing happen) then "the terrorists truly win."

Let's think about what that means. Let's not drape that phrase over everything so that it doesn't mean anything anymore--let's really look at what we mean when we say that.

It means: If we fight like our enemy, we become him.

I can see you're loyal to your party--and I respect that. But come ON, man, you guys are WINNING against the "liberals." See this as a time of reflection, fix some of the problems you got in-house (and don't say you don't have any, because we ALL do) and stop with the trolling.

You don't actually say "let's get dangerous" just before you post, do you? That'd just be creepy.

Posted by: Rob Matsushita at February 4, 2002 10:24 PM

Re: Taxes

The government has always attempted to rationalize taxes away in terms of services. The British attempted to justify taxes based on the military presence which helped america expand, the costs of initial development, and the incredible costs of keeping shipping lanes clear of pirates. At the same time, Britain generally had some war or other going on in a far-flung province, due to either expansion or internal rebellion.

DWD's rationalization is even less valid than that of the British prior to the Revolutionary War. The last time I bothered to check, approximately 1/4 to 1/3 of federal taxes went NOT toward social welfare or national defense (Note that I'm ignoring the obvious difference between national "defense" and having a war-waging apparatus sufficient to obliterate all sapient life on earth several times over), but toward interest on the national debt, which TRIPLED during the 1980's.

Though this undoubtedly comes as a shock to some, there was, long ago, the intention that the national debt would be paid off at some point. That can, of course, only be accomplished by directing excess revenue towards reducing the principle on the debt. Anyone who has ever had a mortgage, a credit card, a student loan, or a loan for a car realizes this basic principle.

Re: if there were revolution/rebellion...

As I've said in the past, the gross majority (90+ percent) of the american population are cattle (or was it sheep? Someone with more motivation than me please scan back to the September log and let me know which it was...) Of those that aren't, many realize that although a minority in the US was sufficient to defeat the British in the Revolutionary war (don't believe me? Check a few advanced history books!), the British had a number of major weaknesses, such as French interference and ultra-long supply lines from Britain to North America. Add in a weak king and a number of idiot generals, along with poor communication, and the US won. That cannot happen today and, realistically, very few of those who realize the necessity of governmental adjustment would willingly go into battle for it.

Might, however, has never made right.

Posted by: JSc at February 4, 2002 10:25 PM

JSc, you kick ass.

Just thought I'd tell you that.

Posted by: Rob Matsushita at February 4, 2002 10:29 PM

Pat yourself on the back for being in the military. Big f*cking deal. You chose to carry a gun. I am not impressed.
We tried to elect the right man for the presidency, but the Supreme Court ripped that away from us. Now we have to deal with a clown in the White House. Again, it's a sad statement and reflection on America that he will probably get re-elected. I Don't have to like Bush to love America. And, unlike most people who bitch about it, I am prepared to do some good WITHOUT carrying a gun and killing people.
Maybe non one talks about what Bush has "done right" because he really hasn't done anything "right" for America yet.

Posted by: Suvau at February 4, 2002 10:29 PM

On a vaguely-related sidenote....

The absolute most ironic thing I've ever seen...

Sometime in mid-October, I was at the grocery store, waiting to check out.

You know how it is. Candy. Tabloids. Fat, shrill women and screaming children. The old lady with 8 million coupons for her two items.

Shit. She wants a price check too.

But I digress.

Hanging between the Coke fridge and the Globe, are a bunch of little american flag pins. $2.95 a piece.

Look on the back.

"Made in China"

Posted by: JSc at February 4, 2002 10:29 PM

Pat yourself on the back for being in the military. Big f*cking deal. You chose to carry a gun. I am not impressed.
We tried to elect the right man for the presidency, but the Supreme Court ripped that away from us. Now we have to deal with a clown in the White House. Again, it's a sad statement and reflection on America that he will probably get re-elected. I Don't have to like Bush to love America. And, unlike most people who bitch about it, I am prepared to do some good WITHOUT carrying a gun and killing people.
Maybe non one talks about what Bush has "done right" because he really hasn't done anything "right" for America yet.

Posted by: Suvau at February 4, 2002 10:29 PM

That bleeding in the bathtub scene seems a little far fetched...kind of like the scene in "if these walls could talk."

Because a lot of those backyard abortions, whatever you want to call them happened because of the social stigma attached to the single mother in the 1940's era. Now a lot has changed where single mothers arn't fround on nearly as much (and in some cases praised). Now the main reasons why people get abortions is because either they feel they are too poor, it will interfere too much with their life, or they just don't want the child.

And those arn't very good reasons. If you couldn't afford not having a child, you should've thought of that before you got pregnant. I realize now it's not politically correct to blame the mothers and fathers for the pregnacy, but they need to take some of the blame. And I do understand the fact that it isn't fair that typically the woman gets all the blame for the pregnacy, when obviously (cliche' ahead) it takes two to tango.

Abortion is tricky...because you can't make it illegal, cause that would open the door to too many other things that the G.W Bush camp would love to jump into. So really their is no answer for this like so many other things and it is just how it is and we just have to wait and see.


Posted by: Cody at February 4, 2002 10:30 PM

Rob rules too.

All this makes me wonder about the nature of humanity. What is right, what is wrong. What is reality.

As Socrates said, in Larry Gonick's "The Cartoon History of the Universe, Vol.1-7":

"Wot is trooth?"

I sure as hell don't know.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 10:30 PM

That bleeding in the bathtub scene seems a little far fetched...kind of like the scene in "if these walls could talk."

Because a lot of those backyard abortions, whatever you want to call them happened because of the social stigma attached to the single mother in the 1940's era. Now a lot has changed where single mothers arn't fround on nearly as much (and in some cases praised). Now the main reasons why people get abortions is because either they feel they are too poor, it will interfere too much with their life, or they just don't want the child.

And those arn't very good reasons. If you couldn't afford not having a child, you should've thought of that before you got pregnant. I realize now it's not politically correct to blame the mothers and fathers for the pregnacy, but they need to take some of the blame. And I do understand the fact that it isn't fair that typically the woman gets all the blame for the pregnacy, when obviously (cliche' ahead) it takes two to tango.

Abortion is tricky...because you can't make it illegal, cause that would open the door to too many other things that the G.W Bush camp would love to jump into. So really their is no answer for this like so many other things and it is just how it is and we just have to wait and see.


Posted by: Cody at February 4, 2002 10:31 PM

That bleeding in the bathtub scene seems a little far fetched...kind of like the scene in "if these walls could talk."

Because a lot of those backyard abortions, whatever you want to call them happened because of the social stigma attached to the single mother in the 1940's era. Now a lot has changed where single mothers arn't fround on nearly as much (and in some cases praised). Now the main reasons why people get abortions is because either they feel they are too poor, it will interfere too much with their life, or they just don't want the child.

And those arn't very good reasons. If you couldn't afford not having a child, you should've thought of that before you got pregnant. I realize now it's not politically correct to blame the mothers and fathers for the pregnacy, but they need to take some of the blame. And I do understand the fact that it isn't fair that typically the woman gets all the blame for the pregnacy, when obviously (cliche' ahead) it takes two to tango.

Abortion is tricky...because you can't make it illegal, cause that would open the door to too many other things that the G.W Bush camp would love to jump into. So really their is no answer for this like so many other things and it is just how it is and we just have to wait and see.


Posted by: Cody at February 4, 2002 10:32 PM

crap sorry about that.

Posted by: Cody at February 4, 2002 10:32 PM

Re: Taxes

Just for reference....

A $1 billion surplus equates to....

$3 per american citizen, presuming 333.3 million americans.

$4 per american citizen, presuming 250 million americans.

Damn.... After the government takes off their cut for processing all that money, I can almost afford a Big Mac.

Posted by: JSc at February 4, 2002 10:34 PM

KJB said: "Rob rules too."

Hey, man, you're the one who went head to head with Count Duckula for the longest.

That's gotta be worth an anti-bloggie.

Posted by: Rob Matsushita at February 4, 2002 10:37 PM

:D

Thanks, Rob.

Posted by: KJB at February 4, 2002 10:39 PM

No, Rob.... You're the one that kicks ass.

When is the next batch of Spudnuts MP3's coming out?

JSc

(Would have emailed, but the idiot sysadmin for my local server has fukt everything to hell and back, and seems to think that it's not his fault....)

Posted by: JSc at February 4, 2002 10:40 PM

"When is the next batch of Spudnuts MP3's coming out?"

When I find a copy of the Star Trek II soundtrack--I'm planning on doing the one about Spud attacking people in the supermarket.

I may not be Spudnuts, but I play him on my website.

Posted by: Rob Matsushita at February 4, 2002 10:50 PM

Darkwing Duck said:

>> DWD, the Conservative Defender of WWDN!

Sir, I support you and salute you.

I think you're naive, nutty as fuck, and just flat out wrong, but I hope you continue to hang. Me-too conversations are just no damned fun. Nothing wrong with having a conservative contingent at WWDN.

I guess I find the "this site is liberal" accusation a bit perplexing, because after all, Television's Wil Wheaton just spent a fair amount of this week's paycheck on broadcasting your conservative opinions on several issues.

And...

To my understanding, if you were to search for this thread some weeks or months from now, chances are all of your words would still be here completely unedited for all to see.

So, why is this site "liberal?"

I guess it's liberal in that the host expresses left sympathies on certain issues and a significant number of posters echo such sentiments with "yeah, that's right" but I don't see where any conservative opinion has been neutered, squelched, or muffled.

Sure, you've been called on your stuff, but what do you expect?

Don't you LIKE to hash this shit out?

I do.

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 11:44 PM

DWD,

Now, if conservative opinions were deleted or otherwise altered then you might have a point and... fuck... I'd be right with you walking out the door, but who is stopping you from making your opinions known?

I will say this though...

Edit.

Seriously.

Don't ratchet down your opinion, but maybe... you know... just pick the best stuff and save the almost-best stuff for ICQ.

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 4, 2002 11:49 PM

Take the 'nuts at his word.

As we all know, he only brings his "A-game" to WW.N, and we all appreciate it.

Posted by: JSc at February 4, 2002 11:52 PM

Well...

Sometimes I just can't hold it until I reach Lakerboard and I have an accident right here on the floor of WWDN in my pants.

But that seems to be rare.

Sort of rare.

It's an issue.

That needs to be addressed.

I admit.

Posted by: Spudnuts at February 5, 2002 12:01 AM

cody, women don't 'get all the blame for the pregnancy.'

women GET the PREGNANCY.

and as for 'That bleeding in the bathtub scene seems a little far fetched...kind of like the scene in "if these walls could talk."

well, i didn't just invent that image for dramatic effect. i'm refering to history, not just a 'hallmark hall of fame' telemovie.

a few years ago, i sat in the gallery of my local state parliament to show my support after a doctor had been arrested for perfoming an abortion...

you see, in WA and victoria (not sure about the rest of australia, though i suspect it's similar), abortion is not explicitly legal. the ancient laws actually forbid it, but are not enforced, and in fact terminations are covered to some extent under medicare. however, the pro-choicers don't push to have the law changed to reflect its practice, since each time they do, it rouses the pro-lifers into action, who then attempt to make the laws harsher.

anyhow, so as i sat in the gallery, a few elderly women came and sat beside me. i eavesdropped on them and we eventually went out for coffee.

their stories, of friends and relatives maimed or worse by the consequences of draconian anti-abortion laws, astonished me. and (as a private pro-choicer who, thankfully, has never had to test her beliefs), i was horrified by the thought that those days could return.

this is never going to be a no-brainer. there are always going to be passionate arguments about this issue because there is no 'right' answer, and the stakes - on both sides - are high.

but i have friends who have had early pregnancies terminated (one, who got pregnant when she was 18, was on the pill and using a condom), and none of them took the decision lightly. as i understand it, it was a complex, emotional choice, and one which they took their time to think about. hopefully the same could be said for those women who have chosen to bring that pregnancy to term.

so, as i said, it's a true dilemna. and one which i, as an individual, demand the right to nut out myself.

personally, if by some turn of events (and yes, i am a staunch advocate of safe sex), i found myself choosing termination, why would the opinions of dubya - or the women's christian league (btw, me? not a christian), or my father, or my bus-driver, expert in all matters ethical that he is - count for more than my own?

i demand the right to make that decision.

or, i'm inviting vanna 'round.

with her hook.

and a bottle of 'beefeater' gin.

mother's little helper, y'know.

Posted by: hot soup girl at February 5, 2002 12:02 AM

Does Vanna White really have a hook for a hand? I'm horribly confused.

Posted by: KJB at February 5, 2002 01:13 AM

yes, KJB, she does.

except when she's wearing her paddle.

for table tennis.

Posted by: hot soup girl at February 5, 2002 01:29 AM

Jeez, nothing like a passing comment that you happen to support abortion to bring out all the weirdos out from the woodwork.

Posted by: Jun at February 5, 2002 01:33 AM

YOINKS!
*Dodges the hot topic of discussion*
HotHotHotHotHOT!!!! Yeow!!

Wil, sorry man if my post was a flame, I honestly didn't mean it to be.
and if it was, I seriously hope it was a well constructed one, not the a-typical "Yeah, we you just suck." flame. (Hates those personaly, and would rather not get into a huge flame war with anyone.)

At least, it shows that people do have brains and are capable of using them. *Points to the mass majority of posters like Spudnuts, DaleBlueEyes and Gaea dor example.*
The GREY MATTER LIVES! IT LIVES!!!

*Ahems*
Sorry...relapse of a derrangement knows as 'Mad Scientist Syndrome'.
At least people here know how to listen, and are able to provide constructive arguments to topics.
~Kaylin

Posted by: Kaylin at February 5, 2002 02:47 AM

Holy cows!! I just previewed what I wrote and it's a freakin' novel! Dude, I didn't know that there was a message board!! Now I'll be posting like crazy...rambling on and on, I'm great at clearing a room. It's my passion it seems to be suffocating. Do not be afraid, I'm just a nerd with WAY too much time on my hands.

Speaking of that totally offensive 'choice is American' commercial......... As a Christian, vegetarian and woman I find myself choking back disgust and wrestling with a heart full of sorrow. I'm a young woman that has yet to have children and yet I can still see the value and preciousness of those little unborn lives. As someone that sees life as wondrous and very much in need of respect, I just can't comprehend how a woman could stand up and say that they feel that it is their right to end the life of their child and in such a gruesome way. This isn't meant to be a self-righteous lecture, just a genuine love of life. I believe that this world would be a much better place if everyone practiced empathy in their everyday lives.


The commercial is correct in that with freedom comes choice, but not the choice of murder. The choice was made to have unprotected sex, why then should the innocent pay? With freedom does come choice, but if you are without love then you are left with nothing but yourself, and as they say one is the loneliest number...Okay so that last part was dorky, but it's late.


The appreciation for life was harshly reinforced for me a few days ago. One of my friends from high school died from a disease that he didn’t even know he had until three weeks before his death. He was only 22. The last time that I saw Ty was about 3 years ago. He came into where I was working at the time, (Blockbuster, good times)and I was kind of cranky and short with him. It had been a while since I had last seen him and it seemed that he wasn’t very happy and that he was struggling in his life at the time. I sort of listened halfheartedly, nodding, smiling and then ended with a quick see ya. How was I to know that that would be the last time that I would see him? I wish now that I would have reached out and at least let him know that if he needed someone that I would be there.


I know that I have written way more than I meant to, but I feel this need to say again what has been said so many times but that never seems to register until tragedy is experienced first hand. Never forget to tell those that you love how you feel. Never walk away from someone in need. My Dad was very ill and had to be hospitalized because of severe pneumonia and I found myself reminiscing about all the time that we had spent together, from infancy to the present. I realized that he has always been an amazing father and sadly that I had never appreciated all the love and unending support even in spite of my most unflattering escapades. I found myself wishing that I had said sorry for all the stupid things that I had done, for all of the hurt that I had caused him. I sat down and wrote him a letter, trying my best to ask forgiveness for those things that he had already out of love forgiven me for. He is healthy and back to everyday life now, but there was a time when the doctors didn't know what was wrong and we were scared to death of the uncertain. There are no words to describe the earth shattering fear and intense regret that crashes down on you when you may lose someone you love. It's like time stops and you're just a numb shell of a person walking around wishing it were all just a nightmare. It's a place we will all be at one time or other in our lives, some will have more regret than others.


I guess I would also say not to put off those 'apology letters' or the mending of fences until faced with hard times. Appreciate your family, your friends, your pets, and your fellow man everyday of your life. You never know when your last chance to say 'I love you' will pass you by.


Okay, you wanna talk about a tangent. My English teachers always told me that I needed to stick to one subject, but I'm a rebel. I guess I haven't really been open with some things like I should have, so I'll use the wwdn message board as therapy. I should open up more, maybe then I wouldn't write in run on sentences. Lol (nerd humor rules!) I'm sure y'all will be happy to hear that I feel much better. Anyway, even though I don't always agree with Wil Wheaton I appreciate the opportunity to exchange ideas and debate intelligently without the resorting to junior high chat room antics. This is an awesome site and I love that he is so open and sincere in his writings. Oh yeah and he's really funny too. Keep up the good work!

Posted by: Mindy at February 5, 2002 03:07 AM

What the hell's wrong with calling a foetus an 'unborn child'? Foetus is a medical term. We don't walk around shouting 'Myocardial Infarction' from the rooftops, but that's what a heart attack is.

If woman are serious about aborting a pregnancy, surely it doesn't matter to them if it's a foetus or unborn child.

I don't like to inflict my views on abortion on others (I'm a Doctor - believe me, I have to be open minded), but to be pedantic, a foetus is defined as "An unborn infant that have developed from an embryo to a stage where it is recognizably human".
And so it would seem the terms are interchangable.

Wil, you rock. But it doesn't mean I have to agree you with, right?

Posted by: Elena at February 5, 2002 03:16 AM

Wow...I want to expound a little luv for KJB.

You rock!

And of course my undying luv for Rob M. and Spudnuts.

And now my last chopstick...

Cody- Right now? Hell yes I would of minded being aborted. I think on a base level I would of been pissed back then if anything happened to interupt my happy home inside a scared 16 yearold. Which would explain my screams when I was born. My grandmother used to say that if I got lost in the blankets that they would be able to find me once I started crying again. I loved that wonky woman.. even her nickname for me.. Katie no nose. "The child had a pimple for a nose!" Thanks Grandmama... Irish women. sheesh.
Anyhoo back to my rant before I get too soft.

I'm a hell of a drinker. I can put away more than most frat boys- which ain't the best thing on an empty stomach. New Years Eve I decided to party a little to hardy..I woke up in the morning to the possibilty of the same as what brought me into this world and it starred at me for 3 whole weeks.. the what ifs.. the what am I going to do if I am really pregnant?
I'm not, I'm thankful, and I've stayed sober ever since. Responsibilty for my own actions.

If anyone wants me I'll be tossing wankers over at the Soulcracker board. ^_^

Have a nice morning Mr. O'Donnell...

Posted by: MissKittyFantastico at February 5, 2002 03:35 AM

If you haven't seen it yet, check out http://toostupidtobepresident.com

Posted by: Renee at February 5, 2002 04:38 AM

Thank you, Miss Kitty. You make a girl with semi-insomnia proud. :)

Keep on rockin, peeps.

Posted by: KJB at February 5, 2002 05:18 AM

mindy, here's what i'm thinking: don't get an abortion. that would be an inappropriate course of action for you. don't do it.

i mean it. no abortions for you, young lady.

or, if circumstances should arise that change your mind, and you then consider it the best course of action for you, then do.

and i'll do the same.

how's that for for an idea?

Posted by: hot soup girl at February 5, 2002 05:23 AM

set phazers to "sarcasm" Mr Crusher....hahaha Honestly wil your post is SPOT ON!!!!(roe V wade is gonna go under with this foetus can be covered shit....god even rockin ronnie didnt try THAT shit!!)

Posted by: brian hunt at February 5, 2002 05:40 AM

For anyone who's still reading, here's a description from CNN of the $43 million that was sent to Afghanistan:

The package includes $28 million worth of wheat from the U.S. Department of Agriculture, $5 million in food commodities and $10 million in "livelihood and food security" programs, both from the U.S. Agency for International Development.

For what it's worth, this article was written 17 May, 2001.

So I guess Wil and the others think we shouldn't have helped out?

Posted by: Scratch at February 5, 2002 06:50 AM

More from the CNN article:

Powell said the U.S. aid is administered by the United Nations and non-governmental organizations, and bypasses the Taliban, "who have done little to alleviate the suffering of the Afghan people, and indeed have done much to exacerbate it."

The sum brings U.S. assistance to $124.2 million for this year, making the United States the largest Afghan donor for the second year in a row. (end quote)

Way to go, Wil. Heaven forbid we should help out some hungry folks.

Posted by: Scratch at February 5, 2002 07:01 AM

Do you really think that the Taliban gave that food to the needy?
They stole shipments from the red cross and other relief organizations headed towards the needy and then turned around with much more effort and gave it to the needy?

I don't care what form that money took- it helped the Taliban stay in power.

KJB- Insomnia caused by stupidity.. I took the wrong pill for my flu at midnight.. had a wonderful wake up at 4 am this morning.. grumble grumble.
Ah well I have my new car to comfort me- well it's really the replacement car to replace the one declared dead. Cause of death determined- attachment of a Flickerstick promotion on the dash board caused a garabage truck to turn right from a left hand lane crushing my little car into a pole.
*shakes head* I need mountain dew.. argh...

Posted by: MissKittyFantastico at February 5, 2002 08:18 AM

ok, this is sort of late as to the abortion topic, but I was listening to CBC this morning and I couldn't believe my ears... There is a new legal term in Canada - "wrongful life". In this court case, parents of a mentally handicapped teenaged girl are arguing that she has a right to have never been born... talk about twisted...
And of course, there is the whole debate of genetic tests and whether an undesirable outcome this should warrant an abortion. I will not express my opinions, as that's all they are, but these are interesting topics to ponder...

Posted by: SpaceCadet at February 5, 2002 09:40 AM

Hi Miss Kitty...

You said: Do you really think that the Taliban gave that food to the needy?
They stole shipments from the red cross..."

I don't know if the Taliban stole it or not, but the fact is that the administration (and congress) gave $43 million in food and aid to the Afghan people, via the U.N., and took steps to keep it out of the hands of the Taliban. And this is wrong?

A little hypothetical scenario for you: the democrats in Congress come up with a program to give food and aid to the people of a small, famine stricken nation that has a brutal group of thugs in charge. Bush and the republicans in Congress block the plan, saying they don't care for the regime and are therefore against sending aid to the poeple. What would you say then? Would you praise Bush? I think you would be on this very page, condemning Bush for blocking the aid. What would you have him do?

Posted by: Scratch at February 5, 2002 10:17 AM

OH SCRATCH YOU GO!! LOL!!

Posted by: DaleJrBlueEyes at February 5, 2002 11:55 AM

Wil... while I understand concern at such strong statements from Bush against several countries the simple reality is we must not only defeat the terrorists who attacked us on 9/11 but also those who have intentions of doing so in the future. Our biggest mistake is if we become reactionary rather than proactive. We simply must prevent things like 9/11 rather than seek retribution.

That might very well mean countries like N. Korea, Iran, and Iraq with their actual or potential nuclear and biological weapons and will to use them against the United States must firmly be leveled in our sights.

Posted by: Dave at February 5, 2002 01:13 PM

Reading this forum, for me, is looking into a whole other world.

I was in Sarajevo in 1997 and saw the depths of cruelty humans are capable of inflicting upon each other. From Mostar to Bihac, evil was apparent, evil essentially perpetrated by all sides. The really sick irony was that death camps in the former Yugoslavia were all a 4.5 hour train ride from Auschwitz. Europe, England, the whole world, none of us could or would do anything to put out the evil on our flank. But, America did.

Those Americans putting their lives on the line in Afghanistan, or elsewhere around the world, get my unconditional support. I find it hard to explain other than to say that the world would be a much sadder and darker place without them or you. Like any country, America is not perfect. But the sons & daughters of America certainly seem to reaching out to do more good than harm. Almost any other power in the world - coming from Europe particularly - would come as conquerors. But, you haven't. You come as liberators.

I know you get a lot of flack from us out here. But, we don't have the military capability to do what you do nor do we have the will power. Even thinking about what I saw in Bosnia now wrenches my heart. You may not want to be the world's policeman, you may not even be perfect at it, but I tell you that, from where I sit, you all have a lot to be very proud of and I mean that sincerely.

I just wonder what it is about us all that lets us tear into each other so rabidly about politics. I know partisanship is really strong and maybe that explains the Clinton-bashing Republicans and the Bush-bashing Democrats. I don't know. But, from here in England, maybe I should view it as a strength of America that you can squabble as you do and stay so strong and free.

With a little luck (since I am a big Star Trek fan after all), I think we'll make it past our petty selves and make it off this little planet. Maybe we'll find a universe far more interesting than we imagined. I always thought my favorite part of Star Trek was that it gave us a compelling vision of a future where just maybe all of us humans could come together and do something great.

I wish you all the best.

Posted by: FromEnglandWithMuchLove at February 5, 2002 02:32 PM

Dave,

Why is it okay for the US to have weapons of terror (fusion/fission weapons, biotech weapons, chemical weapons) but not okay for other countries to have the same?

Posted by: Freddy the Fish at February 5, 2002 02:48 PM

Ok, gonna add my 2.5 or so cents in here, without reading the posts.

I voted for Bush. It was either him or Gore, in my book. I chose the lesser of the two evils. Unlike our esteemed Mr. Wheaton (no sarcasm here... I really look up to ya, Wil), I am on the conservative side. I watch Bill O'Reilly on Fox. I agree with most of what he says. Ok, practically all of it. But that doesn't mean that Mr. O'Reilly doesn't have the ability to get me mad. He does. But I agree with his views.
I guess living in one of the poorest areas of our great country has a lot to do with my views. Appalachia is not a rich, nor populous place. But that is beside the point.
I once read somewhere, not sure where, that the author of the article I was reading thought that Mr. Bush has very gentle eyes. I agree. He cares, people. About this country. About our military. And he cares about what is happening to people in other countries who want to put a stop to our country. I don't think we should have gone into Bosnia. But I DO think we need to be in Afghanistan. Why?? Because women were being majorly discriminated against. Children were being taught to hate. That isn't right. Hopefully, now, the men, women, and children of Afghanistan will be able to have their own views.
*sigh* This isn't going anywhere. But I feel the need to say this: My brother is 18. He isn't going to college. He's probably going to enter the Marines, and he won't be reserve, I fear. He will be active. To me, this says he has a very real chance of going to war in Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, or any other place that supports terrorism. That scares me, ok?? He's my brother, the only one I have; my only sibling. I will support fully the military in what they are doing, and I support our government, because right now, they need support. My best friend's boyfriend is currently in Marine boot camp. He is planning on entering the reserves, but how long will he be in the reserves before he is called to serve?? I am scared for him, too.
In one of my history classes yesterday, we talked a little on this subject. My prof said that we've basically been at war since 1979, when Iran held Americans hostage. I think it's time that something is done about terrorism, so that my children won't have to see two symbols of America tumble to the ground like I did. Some people have said, "Why should we do something about this?? There has been terrorism in the world, and nothing was done." My answer is this: We, the United States of America, are doing something, because these ASSHOLES had the audacity to think that they can just come in here and kill our people and get away with it. Well, they are learning that they can't. They killed 3,000+ of the WORLD'S citizens. If no one else will stand up to these people, who will?? I'll tell ya: The Navy. The Air Force. The Army. The Marines. They are over there trying to make sure that something like this never happens again.

Ok, so that was waaaaaaay more than 2.5 cents. Sorry.

Posted by: Jessica at February 5, 2002 03:41 PM

Whats with this thought of "Lets attack them before they attack us" crazyness!?! Our military should defend not attack. We will only be lowering ourselves down to their level by attacking countrys who haven't attacked us. And wasn't it us who flew spy planes close to china. We are going around looking for a fight. There must be a peaceful common sense way to go about ending terrorism.

Posted by: Artisticspirit at February 5, 2002 06:14 PM

I am from New Zealand, and have to say, I was shocked and disgusted by Sept. 11. You are right about 3000+ of the WORLDS population being massacred. Americans, Australians, New Zealanders, Britons, and many more. The World Trade Center was a veritable United Nations of workers. This affects us all. But blind hatred leads to stupidity and in our stupid haste for blame, innocent people get blamed for things they are not a party to.
Innocent Afghanis will die in their thousands as winter comes to their country. It is not fair to them, is not fair to anyone. The world has changed so inexplicably just in months. We cannot forget these things...but a part of me wishes we could go back to a time before.

A change in topic. Dubya has not won friends in this portion of the world with his shortsighted views. He is a complete pronk. Change your electoral system to something that means the people actually have a say. My god in heaven this roll thing is so confusing!! Apart from that, love Wil and have enjoyed reading all the differing opinions, Hope you all have a great week (what is left of it) and don't stop having original thoughts. They are the backbone of society.

Posted by: Tiana at February 5, 2002 06:48 PM

wil... all of your criticisms toward president bush are really making me NOT want to read your website. your'e entitled to your own opinion but before you start criticizing his budget for having a deficit, why don't you study some economics and stop listening to the mindless election year bullshit spouted by the democrats every day? i hate deficits too but any good economist who is worth our time will acknowledge that the government cannot fight the war on terrorism, revive the economy, and provide for homeland defense without a deficit. once the economy rebounds, we can go back to balancing the budget.

Posted by: Howard at February 5, 2002 07:02 PM

New England WOn!!! My fave team! AND my FAVE bad was THERE! U2!!! It was an omen. If Bono, Edge Larry and Adam were gonna be there, there was no way my team was gonna lose. I think i'm the ONLY girl in my school who actually watched the superbowl. Why am i such a tomboy? Oh well.
I only wanted to comment on that just coz ppl seem to also be pleased that the team not favoured to win DID! HA! *does a "touch down dance"* everything else was.. uh nothin to me coz I';m a Canadian teen who cares about nothing but sports, Drama, art and music. *shrugs*
Oh hell, might as well add this but, ah. I'm on A Wil Wheaton site. WHY?! um.. maybe because my friend found a ppl magazine with an atricle about him and reminded me that 2 years ago i loved the guy. Yes that's probably it. Now thats off my chest.
Salut!

Posted by: Li at February 5, 2002 07:07 PM

"Attack them before they attack us?" They DID attack us!!! As I know you know, 9/11 was not a domestic terror issue. It was another country terrorizing US. All I'm saying is that we shouldn't take it. If we've got the ability to stop these people, we should.

Posted by: Jessica at February 5, 2002 07:17 PM

Jessica,
How DO you know 9/11 wasn't a domestic terror issue?

Posted by: unknown at February 6, 2002 09:25 AM

jessica said 'It was another country terrorizing US'

actually, i was going to leave this nut alone, but since someone's already cracked it open...

as i understand it, al quaeda was responsible for 9/11.

we THINK.

and al quaeda are an underground, de-centralised political organisation 'based' in thirty or so countries.

now, this isn't particularly helpful for bush, since military structures are geared towards 'country vs country' conflict.

answer? attack afganistan.
that's a country.
osama's there.
and that's close enough.

Posted by: hot soup girl at February 6, 2002 10:24 AM

How do I know it's not a domestic terror issue?? Well, I don't. BUT, and here I'm going to get reamed for my beliefs here, but all I can go on is what I'm told. Unfortunately, I'm not high enough on the totem pole to get all the info that Pres. Bush and others are getting. I'm simply a college student at one of the more insignificant universities not only in the country, but also in my state.
The Taliban regime in Afghanistan was supporting terrorism. IMHO, this regime had to be taken out. It was repressing the liberties that we, as Americans, take for granted. Now, maybe I'm just being selfish here, but I would like all people to have the same rights that I do, to share my opinion with others and not get reamed for it. Maybe I'm wrong here, but this is just how I feel. I certainly don't want innocent civilians to get hurt in this. But I don't think that is possible... I wish to God that it were, though...

Posted by: Jessica at February 6, 2002 01:41 PM

"Try this: hold a door open for a stranger today. It's a nice thing to do :)"
So, I'm a little late, but i just wanted to say that few things make me smile more than when someone does this for me or I get the opportunity to do it for someone else
Right on Wil! :)

Posted by: amanda at February 6, 2002 10:35 PM

Thank you. You're a fine human being and and American. Civil Liberties are what this nation stands for, and I'll be right with you defending them to the end. It's so nice to hear that, even with an obscene purported popularity rating, Bush is still getting his clock cleaned for him.

Keep up the good Wil Wheatoning.

--Mitch

Posted by: Mitch Harris at February 7, 2002 03:10 PM

Long time fan, first time visitor to your site. Wesley may have been kind of dorky, but MAN are you cool, Wil. Thanks for your site.

I love your sarcasm in regard to President GWB. It's amazing how quickly he jumped off the 'tax break' bandwagon. For a minute there I thought we might actually not increase the size of government TOO much, but then again I never held my breath all to long either. You know, we COULD actually decrease government spending instead of going into deficit spending... nah, silly me, what am I thinking? :)

Keep up the good work, Wil, look forward to seeing you in Nemesis and any other future projects. Take care,

Bob.

Posted by: Bob Curtis at February 10, 2002 07:39 PM

"To say that it's okay to abort a child if it's rape leads to the conclusion that the child is less a human being because it was a forced act. Since when do we "civilized" humans visit the sins of the parents upon the child?" -- Posted by: KellyV on February 4, 2002 10:53 AM

Kelly, *I* am a woman who got pregnant as a result of a rape and had to make this decision... and I'm telling you right now, that if any human being had dared to tell me that the decision about having the child was not mine to make, they would have found themselves at the wrong end of a gun. I can't begin to explain the terror I went though in the rape, not knowing if I were going to live or die, and the horror of finding out that I might be reminded of that night the rest of my life. Power over my body belongs completely and entirely to me, and no one else, and to me protecting my right to autonomy of my own body is worth killing or dying for.

Posted by: Steph at February 11, 2002 11:22 AM

Dear sir
I am interested Immagrant for your country.
Pls advice me.
Topon rahman

Posted by: Topon rahman at October 15, 2002 02:21 AM

I don't like your STUPID SITE.YOU ARE REALLY A DEVIL.THIS IS SUPOSED TO BE ABOUT SEA PANSY"S NOT SOME STUPID GAME AND YOUR SEX TALK.FUCK YOU!

Posted by: LA at March 31, 2004 10:23 AM

6974 Great posts.

Posted by: direct tv at December 3, 2004 12:48 AM

Where'd everybody go? Helloo-o-o-o-o??

Posted by: mebits at January 10, 2005 01:31 PM

8581 http://www.1freespot.com

Posted by: printer ink at January 24, 2005 12:19 PM
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